Torque tube bearing replacement.

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Number 47
Posts: 199
Joined: 28 Jul 2013 07:11 pm

Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by Number 47 » 12 Jul 2014 06:19 pm

The bearings were shot in my torque tube, horrible rumble from it when in neutral. I have set about replacing the bearings, this is not for the faint of heart. Serious labour is involved. This took me half a day (not counting removal from car) and I needed the help of a second person to sit on it for hours while I wound the things out. (Make sure to bring a present for the wife before asking) :lol: I told mine if she was going to sit on her backside on a Saturday then she may as well be helping me while she did it. :twisted:

Here is what I used.

A 3m long m16 threaded bar. This cost me €24.
5 x m16 nuts. 30c each.
A spin lock from some dumbells. Free.
A large washer I had lying around.
A couple of lawnmower blades I had lying around. Cut to size.
A few blocks of wood.
2 x 24mm spanners.
A bit of old 15w40 I had lying around.
All the energy I had set aside for the rest of the year. :(

The night before I poured about a half liter of oil in and tried to make sure it coated all the way down.It didn't work as expected. More on that later.

I ran the threaded bar up the center of the tube and put the spinlock from the dumbells on, this is weighty and was to act as the puller. I put a washer behind that and then locked two nuts together. Then at the front of the tube I used the lawmower blades to hold my locknut and further up the bar I locked a further 2 nuts together.

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3 meter rod was too long really, could have cut it down a bit but I just propped one end on a mop bucket, this helped when turning as it didn't move around too much. Having the front locknuts half way between the bucket and the tyre gave me room to turn it and stopped me bending the rod too much.

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Here you can see the lawnmower blades and lock nut. I got the my better half to sit on the tube and hold this nut still with the spanner. Welding the nut to the blade would have been easier but I have no gas yet for my welder.

The winding wasn't too difficult at first, then the first bearing caught what I thought was the second bearing. Things got difficult here, eventually the shirt came off and sweat was pouring off me. Lots of breaks, lots of chocolate to keep the energy going. This was really bloody hard. It got harder. sm2 After a good few hours of turning and a lovely blister on the palm of my hand I got to here.

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I added a couple of bit of wood to give it room and carried on turning. I wasn't sure how wide these carriers were, realised after the first one came out and added some wider wood. If you look closely at what should be the third bearing (according to everything I have read and every diagram I have seen) it looks a bit alien. And it was....

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It just seemed to keep on coming, starting to feel like I'm in a Ridley Scott movie, I made the spacers much longer to accommodate the birthing of this strange beast.

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Eventually it all came out, what the hell is this thing?

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It is the reason the oil wouldn't go down the tube, and the reason the pulling was so bloody difficult. It is a big lump of metal with 2 rubber rings on it. Nothing more. No idea why. It has a volvo part number on it.

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Rusty as hell inside, just a solid lump. Weighs about 2kg.

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With the ring removed.

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I though it would be an easy task to just press out the sleeves, press out the bearings and press new ones in. Not so, the casing has a lip on both sides and looks to be rivetted together. The casing have a part number from INA so my local bearing supplier is chasing the number. It is INA F-58114. The bearing inside is INA 6005z, a very common bearing available off the shelf at my local shop for €7.

Front. (Facing clutch end)

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Rear. (Facing gearbox)

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All in all, happy enough. Now to work out how to seperate the bearing casings without damaging them. I may have to modify them as the rivets seem to be offset. The outer rubber is just held in place iside a lip on either side and looks like it will just prise out.

Had enough for now, will keep this updated as progress is made.

Number 47
Posts: 199
Joined: 28 Jul 2013 07:11 pm

Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by Number 47 » 12 Jul 2014 08:03 pm

Right, have recovered a bit and got the bearing out. Simple enough.

The rubber just pulls off, no glue or anything.

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Drill out the rivet, 3 each side.

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I tapped around the seam with a small chisel to seperate it, one side came free.

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I used a 30mm socket to tap the bearing out of the other side.

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I tried to press the plastic/rubber insert out. It didn't work, the insert came out but the flange is bonded to the bearing somehow. I used a 16mm socket with a 30mm on the other side and just pressed it in the vice.

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You can see in this picture where I scraped some away from the bearing face. Will have to get some plastic/nylon inserts made perhaps.

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Number 47
Posts: 199
Joined: 28 Jul 2013 07:11 pm

Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by Number 47 » 12 Jul 2014 09:09 pm

OK, so the rubber insert is actually rubber bonded internally to a metal sleeve, the first one I did the rubber delaminated. The other two pressed out complete.

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There is the slightest of lips on the non flanged side, the one at the rear is the one the rubber insert came out of. I'm thinking to just get some nylon inserts made but I suspect this rubber might dampen vibrations a little.

Anyone got any ideas?

macplaxton
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Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by macplaxton » 12 Jul 2014 10:00 pm

Number 47 wrote:Anyone got any ideas?
Large Scotch? You deserve it for all the effort. sm91
72 DAF 44 Estate 78 Volvo 343DL Black BeautyImageImage
82 Volvo 343DL CVTImageImage 88 Volvo 340DL Diesel

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mac
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Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by mac » 13 Jul 2014 10:18 am

Eventually it all came out, what the hell is this thing?
That, my friend should not be there! - it's a special tool - not one from the dealer tool board but one from the factory.

When the torque tubes were assembled the bearings were pressed in by "your" lump on the end of a hollow hydraulic ram - the first bearing goes in, then, with the tool in place the drive quill is inserted - the tool is withdrawn and the second bearing pressed in (and over the quill) - etc. etc. the rubber rings are there to position the tool and prevent scrape damage to the inner surface of the tube.

I guess in your case the first two bearings were fitted and for some reason the tool was left in place and the last bearing fitted trapping the tool.

How does that sound?

Mac.
(And you thought it was only British car workers in the eighties)
87 3door DL 1.4 58k - 88 3door DL 146k - 88 5door Redline 1.7 52k - 12 XC70 SELux AWD D5 22k
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macplaxton
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Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by macplaxton » 13 Jul 2014 10:44 am

mac wrote:(And you thought it was only British car workers in the eighties)
...and called "Robert" :D




(For young whippersnappers out there, Fiat used to advertise their Strada/Ritmo was "Handbuilt by robots" (and it showed :twisted: ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fXV6KzhBbM leading to this sketch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FU-tuY0Z7nQ )
72 DAF 44 Estate 78 Volvo 343DL Black BeautyImageImage
82 Volvo 343DL CVTImageImage 88 Volvo 340DL Diesel

Number 47
Posts: 199
Joined: 28 Jul 2013 07:11 pm

Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by Number 47 » 13 Jul 2014 11:08 am

Sounds good Mac. I thought it was some kind of balancer having seen similar in the porsche torque tubes while researching this job but there is not one of these in the torque tube I have as a replacement. I'm thinking it was this lump that was causing the resonation when I was moving my tube around the garage. Large lump of heavy metal bouncing around on two rubber rings would do that I think.

Well, seems like my car is special, brought a piece of the factory with it! To think I spent an hour last night trying to source new rubber rings to restore it and pop it back in. It was going in the deox c tank today to remove the rust. :lol:

What do you think of the inserts Mac? I have seen something similar used to support marine shafts and have found a company in India that supply similar but the minimum order is 25 and the sizes are not what I need. 2 of my bearings are shot. Middle and rear are sticky and grinding. Bearings are no issue but the inserts look to be a sticky point. What's your opinion on the plastic/nylon idea?

Thanks for the help. You just saved me hours of twisting that big bugger back up the tube. sm4
Last edited by Number 47 on 13 Jul 2014 11:25 am, edited 1 time in total.

Number 47
Posts: 199
Joined: 28 Jul 2013 07:11 pm

Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by Number 47 » 13 Jul 2014 11:14 am

macplaxton wrote:
Number 47 wrote:Anyone got any ideas?
Large Scotch? You deserve it for all the effort. sm91
I stopped drinking 2 years ago. Haven't had a drop since, was tempted last night though....

Had a large bar of nutty chocolate and watched the Netherlands put Brazil to the sword. Brilliant!

Number 47
Posts: 199
Joined: 28 Jul 2013 07:11 pm

Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by Number 47 » 13 Jul 2014 11:19 am

macplaxton wrote:
mac wrote:(And you thought it was only British car workers in the eighties)
...and called "Robert" :D




(For young whippersnappers out there, Fiat used to advertise their Strada/Ritmo was "Handbuilt by robots" (and it showed :twisted: ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fXV6KzhBbM leading to this sketch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FU-tuY0Z7nQ )

I'm old enough to vaguely remember being massively impressed by the loading in that ad. Never saw the other sketch though. Brilliant. :lol:

Ride_on
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Joined: 26 May 2009 05:34 pm
Location: Belfast, N. Ireland

Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by Ride_on » 13 Jul 2014 01:42 pm

Good teardown and research, looking forward to a full service document, BOM and AVL ;)
1980 345 DL_______1987 360 GLE (project car restored to GLT spec and B230FT'd)
1984 360 GLT______1987 360 GLT
1983 360 GLS______1989 360 GLE
1985 340 GL_______1986 340 1.4
1985 360 GLS______1995 940 SE 2.3 Turbo Estate (daily)
1987 340 GL 1.7

Number 47
Posts: 199
Joined: 28 Jul 2013 07:11 pm

Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by Number 47 » 13 Jul 2014 02:11 pm

Cheers Ride on, excuse my ignorance but what is a BOM and AVL? :?

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Chris_C
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Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by Chris_C » 13 Jul 2014 04:35 pm

Some really helpful pictures there!
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classicswede
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Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by classicswede » 13 Jul 2014 08:51 pm

Good info there.

As to the plastic bits PTFE might be a better choice of material.
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Number 47
Posts: 199
Joined: 28 Jul 2013 07:11 pm

Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by Number 47 » 13 Jul 2014 10:01 pm

Plenty suppliers of ptfe lined steel inserts in China. I was thinking this would not be good as the internal surface should grip the shaft allowing it to spin the bearing? Also takes away a bit of vibration damping. I am experimenting at the moment with a bit of sugru I had lying around. I'm thinking to just buy molded rubber to spec and then gluing it in the steel collars. Custom rubber molds on alibaba are cheap but I would have to buy 100. Even if they are a quid each it is an option.

Here are a few pics of my experiment.

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I've used a socket and a washer to mold the sugru, hopefully it will cure (6 months out of date) and I can get an idea of how it will be to mold my own using some rubber compounds. This is just an experiment. I would make better molds for the real attempt.

Ride_on
Posts: 2240
Joined: 26 May 2009 05:34 pm
Location: Belfast, N. Ireland

Re: Torque tube bearing replacement.

Post by Ride_on » 14 Jul 2014 03:14 pm

BOM = bill of materials (The specification of parts or materials to be purchased for a particular product)
AVL = Approved Vendor List (supplier+suppliers part number)

It what manufacturers use to control their products. Parts that meet the specification and quality, reliability characteristic are approved and added to the AVL (also sometime AML = approved manufacturer list, ie the part rather than its distributor).

I have often thought that such a system would be useful for car forums.
1980 345 DL_______1987 360 GLE (project car restored to GLT spec and B230FT'd)
1984 360 GLT______1987 360 GLT
1983 360 GLS______1989 360 GLE
1985 340 GL_______1986 340 1.4
1985 360 GLS______1995 940 SE 2.3 Turbo Estate (daily)
1987 340 GL 1.7

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