Jacking points where to???

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jimc101
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Jacking points where to???

Post by jimc101 » 11 Feb 2006 08:03 pm

Hi All

Can anyone tell me where you are meant to use as jacking points on the underside of the car when using axle stands. Placing Axle stand on the jacking point as this is the strongest area of the underside leave very few places left to jack onto to raise that car to put them their especiallly at the rear.

Any suggestions?

thanks

James

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340GLT
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Post by 340GLT » 11 Feb 2006 08:13 pm

i dint bother with the jacking points When i jack mine up. To jack it yup use the de dion and front tierod mountings on the crossmember.
As for axle stands, rear de dion and a block ontop of a stand under the outriggers on the front where the two meet should do!!
Cheers Adam
F559 LFE - 340R 2.0 16v
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foggyjames
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Post by foggyjames » 11 Feb 2006 08:25 pm

And translated for the layman...

Jack (trolley jack) on the axle tube, and place the stands on the same...easy.

Front...I tend to find a suitable looking piece of box section, and a big piece of wood...

cheers

James
VOC 300-series Register Keeper
'89 740 Turbo Intercooler
'88 360 Turbo Intercooler
'85 360 GLT
'81 343 GLS R-Sport
'79 343 DL
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...and some modern FWD nonsense to get me to work...

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retrodave
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by retrodave » 21 Aug 2009 02:50 pm

Hey guys,

Sorry to revive an old thread! But I'm having much the same problem with my 1984 340 1.4. I'm new to mechanics so I'm learning the hard way what to do and what *not* to do! (Already tried using the car's scissor jack along with a ramp and axle stand to get the car high enough to slip an axle stand under the front jacking point, and had the car slip off the scissor jack! No harm done except damaged underseal (and bent shaft of the scissor jack!!), but I'm about to re-do with Dinitrol anyway... I think I got away with it this time! :? )

I'm out to buy a proper trolley jack in a bit, but I'm slightly confused about where to place it and the axle stands when jacking up the front of the car (I understand the rear axle bit okay). I've seen a photo online of someone jacking up their 340 with the jack in the centre of the crossmember that the rear engine-mounts bolt onto (No. 15 in the picture) - is the the place 340GLT means when he says "front tierod mountings"? I've attached a scan of the underside of a 340 and circled the centre area I'm talking about.

Also, although I'm planning to use the front jacking points to place the axle stands onto, having had one slip off already I'm tempted to do what you guys are saying and place the stands elsewhere. I'm a bit concerned about using a block on top of the stands though, isn't that a bit risky? I know my stands have huge warnings about using blocks all over them! I've only got some softwood blocks here, so I'm guessing they wouldn't do. My question though is where else can I put the axle stands? You guys mention a strong bit of box-section, I can't see anything obvious on the left and right underside of my car, only the pieces where the engine bearer mounts left and right, would they do? (My car's got splashguards in the way there I think, like the grey rectangles in the scan). And am I right in thinking the "outriggers at the front" are the same as the "front radius arms" mentioned in my Haynes manual (No. 2 in the picture)? I couldn't work out where they "meet" as 340GLT said, I thought perhaps you meant put the stands at or just behind where the radius arms join the main chassis (where I've put the two red circles on my attachment)?

Sorry for the real newbie questions! But thanks very very much for any help you can give me. I'm sure I'm gonna be asking a *lot* of questions on this forum in the future! And hopefully not destroying my car at the same time... :wink:

Cheers guys!


Dave
Attachments
340gl-underbody.jpg
Possible front trolley-jack / axle-stand points???
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volvosneverdie
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by volvosneverdie » 21 Aug 2009 02:58 pm

Welcome to the forum Dave.
I cant help at all, but im logged on, so youre getting a hello!

Ask me one on engine swaps man, youd be laughing. :lol:
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volvodspec
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by volvodspec » 21 Aug 2009 04:21 pm

in the centre circle at 15. don't use the other circle's where 2 is attached to!

and don't use the beam at 9 either :D

kaos
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by kaos » 21 Aug 2009 05:45 pm

for the rear, depending on what i need access to i will jack on the leaf spring clamp, otherwise on the de-dion/axle tube.

on the front, chassis rails come in handy with the right sort of jack, otherwise, cross member
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foggyjames
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by foggyjames » 21 Aug 2009 05:55 pm

The chassis rails are not really strong enough to lift the car - they tend to end up bent.

I jack from the front crossmember (15) and the diff casing at the rear...then put the stands on the jacking points.

cheers

James
VOC 300-series Register Keeper
'89 740 Turbo Intercooler
'88 360 Turbo Intercooler
'85 360 GLT
'81 343 GLS R-Sport
'79 343 DL
'70 164
...and some modern FWD nonsense to get me to work...

Jos360
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by Jos360 » 21 Aug 2009 08:07 pm

Why not beam 9 Anjo? I have my 360 standing on 2 big standards now, and one is on beam-9 with a wooden block in between and the other is on the rear beneath the chassis-beams on wooden blocks. I can't use the jackingpoints as i am welding them.

Jos360
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by Jos360 » 21 Aug 2009 08:08 pm

I can also make a picture of foggyjames's remark, on the chassis beams. They aren't strong enought to lift te car on just a jack, but you have to use a wooden block on the entire beam, then it can't bent.
Mine are bent all the way, due to some stupid mechanic that changed the brakes and didn't look after them... I will take some pictures.

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retrodave
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by retrodave » 21 Aug 2009 08:53 pm

Hey all,

Just wanted to say thanks *very* much for all the replies - you guys rock!! :D I think I'll go for the centre of the crossmember (15) and the jacking points for the axle-stands as foggyjames and volvodspec suggested, sounds good to me! I'm *really* grateful for knowing to avoid the front radius arms (2), I'm sure there's a good reason for this so you've probably just saved my car a busted suspension or something!! :wink: Didn't think about using the leaf-spring clamps though - that might come in real handy.

I'd also be interested to know why you shouldn't use the engine bearer (9), is it because the bearer curves upwards so it'd be easy for something to slip off it? It looks damned sturdy and goes straight onto the chassis...

foggyjames mentioned the chassis rails not being strong enough - I'm *really* new to this so I don't actually know what the chassis rails are! :? I'm guessing they're the sections (underneath the '7' in the pic) the engine bearer / mounts and suspension bolt onto? Seeing those pics would be great Jos360, it'd be useful to know where to use the wooden block safely in case I need to. Really sorry to hear about the damage by the way! That sucks :x Hope he made a better job of the brakes mate! And good luck with the welding.

Lastly a shout out to volvosneverdie - cheers for the greet! :D I might well take you up on that offer when I get tired of my 1.4 - my 340 looks totally original at the mo, sometimes I kinda fancy leaving someone dumbstruck under a cloud of dust at the lights... :wink:

*Really* loving this forum! Big thanks to everyone - I'm sure I'll be picking your brains again soon enough! :)

Take it easy,

Dave

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volvodspec
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by volvodspec » 21 Aug 2009 09:40 pm

Jos360 wrote:Why not beam 9 Anjo? I have my 360 standing on 2 big standards now, and one is on beam-9 with a wooden block in between and the other is on the rear beneath the chassis-beams on wooden blocks. I can't use the jackingpoints as i am welding them.
cause it's mounted in a bend forward (seen from the side); and not straight to the top. if jou lift the car here you can risk bending the mounting plates or/and setting the beam out of it's model.

not a very "big" issue on a 360, but 340 is different story since engine mounts are on that beam too..

jacking on the chassis beam is indeed possible; but only on a few strategic places and with a spreaded support for the jack as jos360 says.

@ foggy; if you're not after removing the rear axle; why not use the rear axle itself for the axle stands? i trust that axle a very big lot more than those thin jacking points if i need to be under the car..

kaos
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by kaos » 21 Aug 2009 10:25 pm

foggyjames wrote:The chassis rails are not really strong enough to lift the car - they tend to end up bent.

I jack from the front crossmember (15) and the diff casing at the rear...then put the stands on the jacking points.

cheers

James

hence why i said with the right jack. last time i used them i had one with a nice wide pad that spread across the entire part, same sort of size as you would find on a 2 poster ramp. not some piddly square ;)

but yes they do bend. and my car is proof of that from the old owners/mechanics.
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foggyjames
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by foggyjames » 22 Aug 2009 12:44 am

I don't see the point in messing with the chassis rails...you don't need to jack there...and they're relatively weak, so I don't risk it.
Dave - the chassis rails are the two 'beams' which run front to back along the floorpan. It's very tempting to try lifting the car on them...but I wouldn't! It's relatively unusual to find a car with totally straight chassis rails, courtesy of some muppet. In the case of my 360, I was responsible for a good chunk of the muppetry...but it is 6 or so years ago. I soon learned my lesson when I saw what I'd done!

The curved front crossmember is quite thin-walled, and can't take the weight of the car. They tend to bend if you try. The main crossmember is much stronger.

I sometimes use the axle for stands (but not for jacking, as it's more effort using a sprung part of the car, so I avoid it if I can). Usually, if I've got the rear of the air in the car, I'll need access to something in that area, and the stands just get in the way. My cars all have solid rear jacking points, so I'm not worried about that. I did get a surprise with a scrap car though....I tried to lower it onto the stands, and the car returned to the ground with the stands firmly embedded in the sills!

cheers

James
VOC 300-series Register Keeper
'89 740 Turbo Intercooler
'88 360 Turbo Intercooler
'85 360 GLT
'81 343 GLS R-Sport
'79 343 DL
'70 164
...and some modern FWD nonsense to get me to work...

Jos360
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Re: Jacking points where to???

Post by Jos360 » 22 Aug 2009 01:10 pm

I took pictures, but most of them are over-lighted or too dark. My phone-cam can't take clear pictures of underneath the car.
But i got 2 where you can see what i meant:

First, the engine-beam of a 360, without engine-supports. I placed a steel stand beneath the car (welded from 180x60x4 beams) and a wooden block beneath that beam: (between the beam and the sump actually)
Image
Solid as a rock!

Second, the chassis beams that have been used as a jacking point. It's the same on the other side (a bit worse though) but all of the pictures are messed up. This will prove the point anyway:
Image

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