Early 360 / 343 S-model [B19A fixed fan] water pump question

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trabitom99
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Early 360 / 343 S-model [B19A fixed fan] water pump question

Post by trabitom99 » 23 Sep 2015 10:30 am

Hello all,

I've got a question concerning water pumps for early B19-engined cars with a "fixed fan" (ie no viscous coupling). Pumps for later cars with a viscous fan have a different part no, and my question is whether or not the two pumps are interchangeable.

Image

The parts manual lists the following parts:

463425 Water pump [for fixed fan]
B19A, CH- 810500 (that's 1983 carb-fed 360s and earlier Volvo-engined "S-models")

3283043 Water pump (also 3344253) [viscous fan]
B19E, B19A CH 810501- (all injected B19 360s and carb-fed B19 360s from 1984)

3344252 Water pump [viscous fan]
B200

Fans and pulleys are also different, so I'm assuming that is where the difference is:

Pulley
1276144 B19A, CH- 810500 [for fixed fan]
3283023 B19A CH 810501-, B19E [viscous]
1346447 B200 [viscous]

Fan
3296426 B19A, CH- 810500 [fixed]
3283062 B19A CH 810501-,B19E, B200 [viscous]

Viscous coupling bits B19A CH 810501-,B19E, B200:
3283063 "friction clutch", part 6
3283026 "washer", part 7

Water pump flange screw
955272, part 2 B19A, CH- 810500 [fixed]
946544, part 8 B19A CH 810501-,B19E, B200 [viscous]


Image

Basically, would a later B19 water pump fit my 1982 DLS even if it has the earlier fixed-fan type? Could the bolt pattern be different?

Cheers

Tom

[PS Edited to add B200 part nos]
Last edited by trabitom99 on 25 Sep 2015 09:03 am, edited 2 times in total.
343 GL Touring B14.1E CVT (155) 98000kms 1980 (sold)
343 L Junior B14.3E MT4 (155) 229000kms 1981 (scrapped)
343 DLS B19A MT4 (155) 167900kms 1982
360 GL Injection B200F MT5 (231) 348598kms 1988 (scrapped)
360 GLT B200F MT5 (302) 226000kms 1988

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Hell Driver
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Location: Doncaster UK

Re: Early B19A 360 water pump question

Post by Hell Driver » 23 Sep 2015 09:11 pm

A couple of years ago I changed the pump on my green (1983 fixed fan) GLS without even even knowing that there was any potential difference. I bought the pump from someone at the Volvo Show and fitted it with no problem. I've just bought a pump off ebay for my other GLS (Gold one with viscous fan). I'm going to change it soon as the old one is noisy. I didn't realise that are any issues with this. I'll soon find out if I'm not lucky second time around! I can't imagine that there would be any problem as I don't see them advertised as for one or the other fan type, just B19. They seen to fit other engines too.
360 GLE Saloon (D 86)
360 GLS (A 84)
343 DL (W 80) :-)
340 GL 1.7 (G 89)
360 GLS (Y 83)
440 Turbo (J 92)
Transit Tipper 125 T350 (02)Alive Again!
Transit Tipper Smiley face Q reg
Mitsubishi Colt 1.1 (54)
R.I.P. 77 343 DL vario :-(

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trabitom99
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Re: Early B19A 360 water pump question

Post by trabitom99 » 24 Sep 2015 07:55 am

Thanks, Andy!

I've been comparing pictures of the two versions on some parts websites, have a look at these:

B19 fixed fan, 463425
http://www.daparto.de/Teilenummernsuche ... /860027328
B19 viscous fan, 3283043 / 3344253
http://www.daparto.de/Teilenummernsuche ... /860027914

B19 fixed fan, 463425
http://www.daparto.de/Teilenummernsuche/Dolz/R193
B19 viscous fan, 3283043 / 3344253
http://www.daparto.de/Teilenummernsuche/Dolz/R198

B19 fixed fan, 463425
https://www.rexbo.de/optimal/wasserpumpe-aq1564
B19 viscous fan, 3283043 / 3344253
https://www.rexbo.de/optimal/wasserpumpe-aq1568

The bolt spacing on the pulley end appears to be different on the "old" versions and the water pump housing is longer. That can't be right, and what's making me a bit suspicious is that the manufacturers of the "early fixed fan" versions appear to say that it's a 200 / 700 pump which also fits 300s. That's unlikely, because of the "pump length" problem.

I think I'll take my chances with the "later version" ...

Cheers

Tom
343 GL Touring B14.1E CVT (155) 98000kms 1980 (sold)
343 L Junior B14.3E MT4 (155) 229000kms 1981 (scrapped)
343 DLS B19A MT4 (155) 167900kms 1982
360 GL Injection B200F MT5 (231) 348598kms 1988 (scrapped)
360 GLT B200F MT5 (302) 226000kms 1988

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Hell Driver
Posts: 1410
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Location: Doncaster UK

Re: Early B19A 360 water pump question

Post by Hell Driver » 24 Sep 2015 10:15 pm

They do look different. I may have just bought another spare for my fixed fan GLS then! At least it was only £12 delivered.

I'd better not change the pump when I need the car in a hurry in case I have to order another for the later car.
360 GLE Saloon (D 86)
360 GLS (A 84)
343 DL (W 80) :-)
340 GL 1.7 (G 89)
360 GLS (Y 83)
440 Turbo (J 92)
Transit Tipper 125 T350 (02)Alive Again!
Transit Tipper Smiley face Q reg
Mitsubishi Colt 1.1 (54)
R.I.P. 77 343 DL vario :-(

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trabitom99
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Re: Early 360 / 343 S-model [B19A fixed fan] water pump ques

Post by trabitom99 » 25 Sep 2015 09:37 am

Have you got a picture of your "fixed fan type" water pump? To be sure of the differences, I'd have to remove the fan, pulley and drivebelts from my car, so I did a bit of lazy googling instead.

I'm guessing now that the two B19 water pumps are NOT interchangeable.

The water pump on my '82 fixed fan DLS:

Image

This is what the pulley should look like (1276144, B19 fixed fan):

Image
Image

and what an earlier B19 pump should look like. According to the bills that came with my car, this is the same pump fitted to my car (270681) which surprises me as I thought all water pumps for our cars had to be 300-specific because of the shorter pump length compared to 200s/700s. Anyway, have a look at the shape of the pulley end of the pump:

Image

I'm not 100% certain, but I think this is a later B19 pulley (3283023, B19 viscous):

Image

and the late-type B19 water pump I recently bought:

Image

Just by looking at the different shape of the flange (and the pilot in the middle of it) I don't think the two types are interchangeable. In order to fit the later type water pump, I guess I'd have to install the viscous type fan AND the later B19 pulley as well.

Cheers

Tom
343 GL Touring B14.1E CVT (155) 98000kms 1980 (sold)
343 L Junior B14.3E MT4 (155) 229000kms 1981 (scrapped)
343 DLS B19A MT4 (155) 167900kms 1982
360 GL Injection B200F MT5 (231) 348598kms 1988 (scrapped)
360 GLT B200F MT5 (302) 226000kms 1988

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trabitom99
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Re: Early 360 / 343 S-model [B19A fixed fan] water pump ques

Post by trabitom99 » 25 Sep 2015 01:03 pm

Another theory I'd like to share: I'd always thought that ALL V360 water pumps were shorter than V200/700 ones, because of clearance problems. Maybe that's not true for fixed fan types. Maybe the viscous coupling got in the way, so Volvo thought it was a good idea to chop 2cm off the water pumps for their later 360s, and earlier pumps are easily interchangeable from a 240/740 from the early eighties.

I don't know whether that's true or not, but it sounds feasible!

Tom
343 GL Touring B14.1E CVT (155) 98000kms 1980 (sold)
343 L Junior B14.3E MT4 (155) 229000kms 1981 (scrapped)
343 DLS B19A MT4 (155) 167900kms 1982
360 GL Injection B200F MT5 (231) 348598kms 1988 (scrapped)
360 GLT B200F MT5 (302) 226000kms 1988

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Hell Driver
Posts: 1410
Joined: 18 Aug 2009 09:58 pm
Location: Doncaster UK

Re: Early 360 / 343 S-model [B19A fixed fan] water pump ques

Post by Hell Driver » 26 Sep 2015 01:36 am

Bugger, I've just bought an early type pump to fit a later fan :roll: At least I now have a spare for the green GLS, although that one was only done a couple of years ago.
360 GLE Saloon (D 86)
360 GLS (A 84)
343 DL (W 80) :-)
340 GL 1.7 (G 89)
360 GLS (Y 83)
440 Turbo (J 92)
Transit Tipper 125 T350 (02)Alive Again!
Transit Tipper Smiley face Q reg
Mitsubishi Colt 1.1 (54)
R.I.P. 77 343 DL vario :-(

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Re: Early 360 / 343 S-model [B19A fixed fan] water pump ques

Post by classicswede » 27 Sep 2015 10:09 pm

I'm certain the B19 with fixed fan does use the B21/23 240 water pump. They are not very common with a fixed fan. We all know how Vovlo like to use off the shelf parts
Dai

Please email me directly on dai@classicswede.co.uk

http://www.classicswede.com

phone/text 07824887160

Web shop http://www.classicswede.co.uk/

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Re: Early 360 / 343 S-model [B19A fixed fan] water pump ques

Post by trabitom99 » 29 Sep 2015 03:49 pm

That's good to know Dai, thanks. It might be an idea to update your website on this, so people don't order the wrong thing?
http://www.classicswede.co.uk/360_Water ... 01627.aspx

water pump "type 1":
463425 OR 270681
1981 B19 carb "fixed fan"
1982 B19 carb "fixed fan"
1983 B19 carb "fixed fan"

water pump "type 2":
3283043 OR 3344253
1983 B19 injection "viscous fan"
1984 B19 all models

water pump "type 3":
3344252
1985 onwards B200 all models

Cheers

Tom
343 GL Touring B14.1E CVT (155) 98000kms 1980 (sold)
343 L Junior B14.3E MT4 (155) 229000kms 1981 (scrapped)
343 DLS B19A MT4 (155) 167900kms 1982
360 GL Injection B200F MT5 (231) 348598kms 1988 (scrapped)
360 GLT B200F MT5 (302) 226000kms 1988

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