correct lubes for trans+final drive

B14, B172, B19/200, D16 engine, ignition, cooling, fuel & exhaust system, gearbox, variomatic, final drive... | Tuning: engine swaps, welded diff, clutch upgrades...
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sven360
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Post by sven360 » 02 Feb 2006 10:56 pm

Spoke to the guy who had the rally car before me and my bro-he said the straight cut box had synthetic gear oil in and shuldn't have made any difference over ATF :?

Well summit happened 'cos I broke one of the constant gears up front in the nose cone :cry:

Any thoughts whether this could be attributed to lube?

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volvo300
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Post by volvo300 » 06 Feb 2006 10:48 pm

Hi.

Would just finnish my "gear oil change experience", and it's a lot better with Castrol TQ (ATF Type A, suffix A).
The gears changes a lot better and much more smooth... even after long drives.

Regards.
Peter
Volvo 360 GLT saloon - (RIP old mate)
Volvo 343 R-sport No. 5 - 1981 - Restored and back on the road :-)
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Dan P
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Post by Dan P » 09 Feb 2006 10:18 pm

For the gearbox I use Mobile 5w-50 and the differential Mobile mobilube 75w-90.

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volvo300
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Post by volvo300 » 10 Feb 2006 11:44 pm

Dan P wrote:For the gearbox I use Mobile 5w-50 and the differential Mobile mobilube 75w-90.
I thought that the M47R (and M45R) was strictly ATF lube trannys!
I use 80W-90 GL5 for the diff.!
How is the gear changing after the tranny is hot?
Even after the change from Type F to Type A the change is a little bit hard and the syncromesh have seen better days :-(

Regards.
Peter
Volvo 360 GLT saloon - (RIP old mate)
Volvo 343 R-sport No. 5 - 1981 - Restored and back on the road :-)
http://www.volvo300.dk (soon updated with restoration pics)

Dan P
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Post by Dan P » 11 Feb 2006 03:29 am

volvo300 wrote:
Dan P wrote:For the gearbox I use Mobile 5w-50 and the differential Mobile mobilube 75w-90.
I thought that the M47R (and M45R) was strictly ATF lube trannys!
I use 80W-90 GL5 for the diff.!
How is the gear changing after the tranny is hot?
Even after the change from Type F to Type A the change is a little bit hard and the syncromesh have seen better days :-(

Regards.
Peter
The shifting is much easier with Mobile 5w-50 and the gearbox makes much less noice @ idle and driving.

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volvo300
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Post by volvo300 » 12 Feb 2006 10:45 am

Dan P wrote:
volvo300 wrote:
Dan P wrote:For the gearbox I use Mobile 5w-50 and the differential Mobile mobilube 75w-90.
I thought that the M47R (and M45R) was strictly ATF lube trannys!
I use 80W-90 GL5 for the diff.!
How is the gear changing after the tranny is hot?
Even after the change from Type F to Type A the change is a little bit hard and the syncromesh have seen better days :-(

Regards.
Peter
The shifting is much easier with Mobile 5w-50 and the gearbox makes much less noice @ idle and driving.
Could be worth a try.
Volvo 360 GLT saloon - (RIP old mate)
Volvo 343 R-sport No. 5 - 1981 - Restored and back on the road :-)
http://www.volvo300.dk (soon updated with restoration pics)

D.J. Jonny Long
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Post by D.J. Jonny Long » 15 Mar 2006 12:48 am

I hate ATF. It's for automatic transmissions or for people who want the slick hair look. Gear oil is for gears and so on.. I found the cheapest and easiest way for me to do my oils is to use volvo penta oils as I have a large marine engine/gearbox and I do buy it in bulk from the stealership here. So, I use volvo penta DP290 gear oil for my diff and the same with a gearbox additive such as bi-tron in my gearbox. Gear changes are as good as can be expected (the person that owned the car before me wore out the synchro rings in 4th, and second isn't that much better) even when hot.

The advantage of using a "good" oil is that heat from friction is reduced. although it is good also to use "cheap crappy" oils for a flush to clean the gear casings and remove as much wear causing particles from the oil, I do not leave the cheap oil in there longer than a 15 minute drive to the end of my driveway and back. I generally do oil changes every 200 hours which for me is every 3 months using a flush between every oil change. I go through a lot of filters, I buy them by the box. This may seem excessive, but at the moment the best thing about my car is the engine and drive assembly as the rest is "falling apart" so to speak and I need it to last as long as it can.

Sorry for this turning into an essay, but oil is an important part of an engine, specially in a marine engine that takes more of a thrashing than my car and I do want to get home every day. Different oils and filters even have the potential to increase/decrease horsepower and efficiency. ATF is too thin to provide prolonged protection in a manual gearbox because when it gets hot it breaks down and then when cold, oil particles can become partially abrasive (I have seen this in several instances, especially my hydraulic steering system and it caused premature failure of my marine gearbox) granted that being in a different part of the world, and that cars and boats are different animals, oils ain't oils!

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foggyjames
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Re: correct lubes for trans+final drive

Post by foggyjames » 22 May 2013 09:28 pm

Biiiiiig bump!

I need to order some box oil. It seems ATF Type A Suffix A isn't easy to find. Reading this thread has made me wonder exactly what my box has in it at present, and if that's potentially responsible for the crunchy 3rd...it's not like they're famed for it! I have another box as a back-up, but it'd be good to know...

Mobil 220 seems to be the most readily available A/A compliant / compatible ATF. Can anyone think of a reason to avoid...?

cheers

James
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'88 360 Turbo Intercooler
'85 360 GLT
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Chris_C
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Re: correct lubes for trans+final drive

Post by Chris_C » 23 May 2013 12:43 am

I need some too, in the near ish future.

220 certainly lists A/A compatibility on their website, however... just checking google shows this http://www.gannonoils.co.uk/images/stories/atf_200.pdf which reckons 200 is A/A, 220 isn't.

Is it worth ringing up the MG Owners club (as I believe they are a Castrol supplier) to see if they can get an A/A? Especially as they are now the VOC membership sec!
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foggyjames
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Re: correct lubes for trans+final drive

Post by foggyjames » 23 May 2013 12:51 am

I have a feeling 200 has been superceded by 220. Normally I wouldn't be super-concerned, but talk of synchros going stiff with heat is interesting.

In some of the 'upright' applications (2/7/900), one or two years were factory-specified to use 10w40 engine oil...

cheers

James
VOC 300-series Register Keeper
'89 740 Turbo Intercooler
'88 360 Turbo Intercooler
'85 360 GLT
'81 343 GLS R-Sport
'79 343 DL
'70 164
...and some modern FWD nonsense to get me to work...

pettaw
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Re: correct lubes for trans+final drive

Post by pettaw » 23 May 2013 05:29 am

Holy thread bump!

ATF A/A is the best way to go, but its all been superceded by the Dexron types, so really any of those DII or DIII etc will work fine. Really the spec for ATF is just to ensure constant viscosity across a wide temperature range, rather than using the additive packs for all the various bands and clutches, so I don't think it matters all that much? Having said that I would avoid the Mercon and Ford types, and stick to the Dexron type.

They did indeed specify engine oil 10w40 as a lube and I have a funny feeling still do for some g/boxes but I reckon that ATF still works better. Last time I did a refill I just used Castrol TQD I think.

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Re: correct lubes for trans+final drive

Post by Nimminz » 23 May 2013 08:31 am

I used ATF Dextron III the first time I swapped the boxes on my car and found it made more noise and leaked easier but worked spot on.
Now My gearbox has 10w40 in it - Gear changes get easier after about a mile / 10 mins before that it's a tad more difficult than usual. Seems to work fine and once it's warm it's just as good as ATF i'd say. Main advantage is the cheapness :D Not had it in over winter yet mind ...
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foggyjames
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Re: correct lubes for trans+final drive

Post by foggyjames » 23 May 2013 09:14 am

Thanks guys :)

cheers

James
VOC 300-series Register Keeper
'89 740 Turbo Intercooler
'88 360 Turbo Intercooler
'85 360 GLT
'81 343 GLS R-Sport
'79 343 DL
'70 164
...and some modern FWD nonsense to get me to work...

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Chris_C
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Re: correct lubes for trans+final drive

Post by Chris_C » 23 May 2013 10:44 am

I've also had a fairly in depth chat with Mac about ATF vs 10w40, as I used 10w40 once and found it made the syncros get "in the way" more than normal. From memory (I'm sure he will correct me if wrong) the conclusion was the ATF produced a whine in service, which the general person didn't like the sound of. 10w40 was quieter, but not quite as good, therefore to 95% of people it was a great solution.
'89(G) 340 GLE B172k
'03 S60 D5 SE, '91 (J) MX5, 1954 Cyclemaster
Ex:
'89(F) 340 GL F7R (ex B172k) - Fake -> SBKV 300 Runner Up 08, 12; '91(H) 340 GL B14.4E - Kar; '88(F) 360 GLT B200E - Jet -> BKV 300 Runner Up 09; '89(G) 360 GLT B200E - Beast

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Alex Laidlaw
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Re: correct lubes for trans+final drive

Post by Alex Laidlaw » 24 May 2013 01:07 am

I've always stuck 10W40 in mine, is a bit difficult to get into gear when cold, but not really anything to worry about. Most important thing is to change it regularly, I bet most 300s haven't had a gearbox oil change since their original owners stopped taking them to main dealers.

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