Area or route speed enforcement being introduced

[MJ]

I saw on the local news last night that a new system of area or route speed enforcement is going to be introduced to roads in Devon. Although the piece wasn't clear on how this works, it would appear to be a system of average speed measurements over whole stretches of road.

This would be fine if the speed limit was sensible, but many parts of the road they mentioned have recently been reduced from 60 to 40, even though they are wide with good viability and out of residential areas. Another part was reduced to 40 after the driver of a car with no MOT crashed. Many of the fatalities on that road involved motorcyclists who travel to this part of the country for the nice twisty roads, which can be dangerous without local knowledge.

Here's a link to the piece
http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/nol/newsid ... =rm&news=1

Why do we all have to suffer because of a few peoples mistakes. Some people have driven those roads for years and years without accident, and using their good judgement to choose a suitable, safe speed. Now it's all about telling everyone exactly what they can't do, rather than let people use their own brains.

I want out of this country Either that, or time to join the anti-camera vigilantes...

End of rant.

[huskyracer]

I am with you 100% there, this system of average speed measurement will rapidly become more wide spread- I think the powers that be have realised that most of the time, most drivers know were speed traps/cammeras are likely to be located and slow down accordingly, leaving only the forgetfull or those 'not from around these parts' to get busted and have there wallets relieved of some hard earned. instead they can use numberplate recognition cammeras to monitor your travels. Get from A to B quicker than they think you should, and the first thing you will know about it is when the fine / ban / summons lands in your letterbox.
IMHO this is a system purely designed to releve us of cash and has no real bearing on road saftey, it also allows cut backs on officers running cammera vans, radar traps etc etc so less enforcement of the other traffic laws, most of which in my opinion are far more relevant to road saftey anyway.

[MJ]

Yeah, it makes more sense on the monetary side. AT the moment we're quite lucky, there's only one camera near by that I pass regularly, and one location sometimes used by mobile vans. A lay by, on a corner, in a 40 limit about half a mile from the nearest town, and only a few hundred yards after the 60 limit ends. So I'm sure people have entered the 40, started slowing, but still have been doing over 40 and before they know it, flash

Although doing an average of over 60 along most parts of this road would be rather difficult, so I should be fine, it's more freedom gone, more worry of checking the speed all the time rather than looking where your going.

There have been many studies showing that drivers concentrate more at higher speed, defiantly true. It's very easy to loose concentration when going far slower than is safe.

[Roop]

Get from A to B quicker than they think you should, and the first thing you will know about it is when the fine / ban / summons lands in your letterbox.
IMHO this is a system purely designed to releve us of cash and has no real bearing on road saftey,

Spot on. Average speed systems such as these don't actually stop anyone speeding, they just make them pay for it. Call it speed tax.

I presume you're all familiar with the section of the M4 with average speed recording cameras? Because of the way they are set up, they can only keep track of a vehicle if it stays in the same lane as it passes under the gantry mounted cameras along the road. Therefore, those road users intent on speeding have to weave between lanes every now and then to avoid getting caught, rather than just nailing it along the outside lane.

[Chris_C]

Which bit of the M4 mate? They seem to be moving them around on the A34--A419 stretch with 'roadworks' (not seen any working...) Gone are the days of just leaving the damn things up north

[Roop]

Between Chippenham (J17) and some point past Swindon but before Newbury. Not been that way for a while, but I think they set it up about 3 or 4 years ago.

[pettaw]

Yeah, I've seen new SPECS cameras monitoring average speeds on the northern stretch of the M25 from junc 28-25, unmarked and you wouldn't know they were there unless you know what they look like There's no roadworks or anything round there, so there's no excuse for them.

Not to mention the CCTV on virtually any main road in London monitoring yellow box and bus lane infringements. Luckily these ones have no penalty points attached to them, just pay the fine and forget.

Also ANPR cameras are springing up as though they're breeding I've counted at least 5 new sites in the last few weeks.

Make no mistake, big brother is watching you....31mph? he'll have you.

[Chris_C]

Yeah, I've seen new SPECS cameras monitoring average speeds on the northern stretch of the M25 from junc 28-25, unmarked and you wouldn't know they were there unless you know what they look like There's no roadworks or anything round there, so there's no excuse for them.

Bugger... *goes to check which way the junctions go*

Phew... thought it was that way.

[MJ]

Big brother indeed

If you were to tape a bag over a camera, you couldn't be done for criminal damage, but could you be done for something else, like preventing the course of justice or something?

If they're gonna come here, I may have some friends wanting to know how to deal with them without getting on the wrong side of the law

[huskyracer]

Freaky, my one and only speeding fine was by a mobile unit set up behind a hedge, right on the change form a 60 to a 30, just as you go through the village, before you turn right down the lanes to get to santapod. I know it well and I have a very nice picture of the back of my car, brake lights on, with the big sign that lights up slow down clearly not illuminated beside me. My crime? 34 MPH. Road saftey? not likely

Also, I have first hand experience of the driving fast concentrating or driving slow but being asleep secnario, I've lost count of the times I have nearly fallen asleep at the wheel of the beetle (max motorway speed 70) on the motorway going to and from shows, on the flipside, I cant ever recall ever feeling more than 110% on it when coming back from south end cruise usualy it would be gone 4 in the morning, and was done pinned in top in me chavalier sriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii in my defence I was young at the time

[jtbo]

Silly it is, why they could not concentrate on real problems instead of this kind of flower hat policy. If one drives 80 or 90 kph it really does not make difference in practise, only at paper, but still that is what is priority in speed control.

What about drunk driving, those do ignore any rules anyway, no matter what is the system, here those are responsible of quite big part of bad accidents.

Also here in traffic there dies perhaps 200 persons in year, but alcohol kills over 900 if my memory serves me correctly. What is done to alcohol problem? Nothing, maybe few posters to walls, but traffic gets more gazo like things and perhaps some more big brother devices.

Freedom and democracy seem to be quite an illusion, when we must all cut hair same way, wear same clothes and such?

I guess here they do similar things soon, our politicians are copying everything from your's anyway

[jtbo]

Btw, if you haven't then make sure you watch 2057, you can watch it 'cheap' from here: http://www.tv-links.co.uk/show.do/1/1123

Interesting visions about our future, also not so far out as 1984 during it's time and how close that did make?

[foggyjames]

I do hope the previous owner of my 343 doesn't get a fine on his doormat, as I had to go rather briskly in order to catch Ryan (who will also get one, if I do) up through that section of the M25.

To be honest...I prefer Specs to Gatsos, as long as you know they're there. I have no problem with observing a speed limit as long as it is FAIRLY enforced. Getting 'tricked' by a hidden gatso or camera van is plain unfair.

My mate got away with a flash from a Gatso at 60mph in 50mph (inactive) roadworks a year or two ago. 10s earlier there'd been cars blasting past doing the ton. The irony was that he was doing 60mph all the way from Derby to Devon (and used £10 of diesel to do so, for his trouble...nice!).

On the specs sections I know of, no-one speeds...end of. If we're going to have that kind of nanny-state culture, at least let's do it fairly.

Of course I totally agree that speed has next to nothing to do with road safety....except that if you do have a mechanical failure, or (more likely) suffer an incident due to someone else's stupidity, you're more likely to die.

I had to 'make smoke' today when someone pulled out to overtake a car in front when I was alongside him...and had 20mph on him. That was a brown pant moment. I'm guessing he was using about the same amount of brain power as he was the day he bought his Primera

cheers

James

[MJ]

I've just seen the city version of that 2057 thing; scary stuff. It did remind me a lot of the Back To The Future films, like the holographic shark that Marty sees in 2015.

The scary thing is, the films were made between 1985 and 1990, so we're now closer to the imagined 2015 than the 'present day' 1985 when it was filmed. Some parts have come partly true, like multiple TV channels, video conferencing, automated payment, fingerprint locks. Others are a fair way off like hover cars.

Anyway, I digress. The future seems a scary place with all the invasions of privacy, computers being so vital that a crash would shut down a city etc. I'm sure the near future won't be greatly different to today really, predictions are always a bit outlandish, but we're bound to see simpler versions of this stuff filtering down.

For example in that program they showed cars automatically stopping for obstacles. Well that's starting to come in, eg one of the new Mercs has it. I'm sure many of you have seen the press demonstration where the driver forgets to switch it on. Anyway, what happens when every car has this and say a car suddenly swerves in front of you. You may choose to swerve into the ditch to avoid ramming the car side on, but what if the computer doesn't allow that? Maybe some guys jump out in front of you with guns to ambush you, and someone runs to your door? You may want to hit the throttle and get the heck out of there, but what if the computer stops the car?

I feel old and grumpy now, it's not like when I was young.. Anyway, rant over. Thank you and goodnight

[foggyjames]

I'm pretty certain some of the new Volvos have adaptive cruise control which will apply the brakes to stop you hitting something.

cheers

James