The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
-
- Posts: 1921
- Joined: 06 Dec 2008 09:35 pm
- Location: Netherlands.
- Contact:
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
it's the B14.1E engine so unlike the .0E it allready has the later type (bigger) valves.
i'd just forget about thread inserts and throw a B14.3E or B14.4E cylinder head on; instant luxury of not having to use leadadditive
direct swap and you can either drill the new waterpipe into the B14.4E cylinder head; or rerout the waterhoses going to the carb like i did.
i'd just forget about thread inserts and throw a B14.3E or B14.4E cylinder head on; instant luxury of not having to use leadadditive
direct swap and you can either drill the new waterpipe into the B14.4E cylinder head; or rerout the waterhoses going to the carb like i did.
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
How rough are the northern cars for that to win something
Glad to see she's not sitting about though
Glad to see she's not sitting about though
'89(G) 340 GLE B172k
'03 S60 D5 SE, '91 (J) MX5, 1954 Cyclemaster
Ex:
'89(F) 340 GL F7R (ex B172k) - Fake -> SBKV 300 Runner Up 08, 12; '91(H) 340 GL B14.4E - Kar; '88(F) 360 GLT B200E - Jet -> BKV 300 Runner Up 09; '89(G) 360 GLT B200E - Beast
'03 S60 D5 SE, '91 (J) MX5, 1954 Cyclemaster
Ex:
'89(F) 340 GL F7R (ex B172k) - Fake -> SBKV 300 Runner Up 08, 12; '91(H) 340 GL B14.4E - Kar; '88(F) 360 GLT B200E - Jet -> BKV 300 Runner Up 09; '89(G) 360 GLT B200E - Beast
-
- *** V3M DONOR ***
- Posts: 9361
- Joined: 29 Jan 2004 04:20 am
- Location: Nottingham, UK
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
...well I better 'fess up that it was the only one there!
I'm ordering some new thread inserts (and a head set), then taking a spare .4E head with me in case that doesn't work. To RRG, one way or another...(or possibly not)!
There are various people interested in the car, so I'm sure when the time comes (I'm thinking fresh MOT in September / October) someone will be the obvious choice.
cheers
James
I'm ordering some new thread inserts (and a head set), then taking a spare .4E head with me in case that doesn't work. To RRG, one way or another...(or possibly not)!
There are various people interested in the car, so I'm sure when the time comes (I'm thinking fresh MOT in September / October) someone will be the obvious choice.
cheers
James
VOC 300-series Register Keeper
'89 740 Turbo Intercooler
'88 360 Turbo Intercooler
'85 360 GLT
'81 343 GLS R-Sport
'79 343 DL
'70 164
...and some modern FWD nonsense to get me to work...
'89 740 Turbo Intercooler
'88 360 Turbo Intercooler
'85 360 GLT
'81 343 GLS R-Sport
'79 343 DL
'70 164
...and some modern FWD nonsense to get me to work...
-
- *** V3M DONOR ***
- Posts: 4398
- Joined: 06 Jan 2007 02:38 pm
- Location: Bonn, Germany
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
That sounds interesting. Does that mean you can use 95 RON fuel as well, if the timing is adjusted? I'm using 98 RON plus lead additive with my B14.1E ATM. Is there a thread about the conversion anywhere on V3C? Is the B14.3 head identical with the B14.4 head?volvodspec wrote:throw a B14.3E or B14.4E cylinder head on; instant luxury of not having to use leadadditive
direct swap and you can either drill the new waterpipe into the B14.4E cylinder head; or rerout the waterhoses going to the carb like i did.
James, now I know what your car reminds me of:
Cheers
Tom
343 GL Touring B14.1E CVT (155) 98000kms 1980 (sold)
343 L Junior B14.3E MT4 (155) 229000kms 1981 (scrapped)
343 DLS B19A MT4 (155) 167900kms 1982
360 GL Injection B200F MT5 (231) 348598kms 1988 (scrapped)
360 GLT B200F MT5 (302) 230000kms 1988
343 L Junior B14.3E MT4 (155) 229000kms 1981 (scrapped)
343 DLS B19A MT4 (155) 167900kms 1982
360 GL Injection B200F MT5 (231) 348598kms 1988 (scrapped)
360 GLT B200F MT5 (302) 230000kms 1988
-
- Posts: 1921
- Joined: 06 Dec 2008 09:35 pm
- Location: Netherlands.
- Contact:
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
jup! RON95 unleaded with a slight timing tweek is indeed possible on a B14.1E hybrid. it's even on the V3M forum
you can do the same on a .2E engine but unfortunatly not with a .0E engine as these have smaller inlet valves. if you do have a MY76/77 car with a .0 engine and want the pleasure of 95 unleaded; throwing a .1E or .2E (+carb and distributor) in with a .4 head is the best solution to keep the originallity level somewhat alike.
http://www.volvo300mania.com/forum-uk/v ... 5&start=30
only thing i didn't bother to do is drill out the normal waterpipe hole, that's quite an easy job if you measure out the correct location using the old cylinder head.
the .3E and .4E are the cyl heads with the hardened valve seats and allthough they do have slight differences they are fysically the same and can be exchanged/swapped, you do want to stay away from the .3S and .4S versions as these have the pulsair pipes sticking out
you can do the same on a .2E engine but unfortunatly not with a .0E engine as these have smaller inlet valves. if you do have a MY76/77 car with a .0 engine and want the pleasure of 95 unleaded; throwing a .1E or .2E (+carb and distributor) in with a .4 head is the best solution to keep the originallity level somewhat alike.
http://www.volvo300mania.com/forum-uk/v ... 5&start=30
only thing i didn't bother to do is drill out the normal waterpipe hole, that's quite an easy job if you measure out the correct location using the old cylinder head.
the .3E and .4E are the cyl heads with the hardened valve seats and allthough they do have slight differences they are fysically the same and can be exchanged/swapped, you do want to stay away from the .3S and .4S versions as these have the pulsair pipes sticking out
-
- *** V3M DONOR ***
- Posts: 4398
- Joined: 06 Jan 2007 02:38 pm
- Location: Bonn, Germany
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
Of course, silly me I'll keep an eye out for a good B14.3E / B14.4E cylinder head then, 98RON plus additive is a bit annoying ... S versions were for Sweden, so I doubt I'd come across any of those too often.volvodspec wrote:it's even on the V3M forum
http://www.volvo300mania.com/forum-uk/v ... 5&start=30
Tom
343 GL Touring B14.1E CVT (155) 98000kms 1980 (sold)
343 L Junior B14.3E MT4 (155) 229000kms 1981 (scrapped)
343 DLS B19A MT4 (155) 167900kms 1982
360 GL Injection B200F MT5 (231) 348598kms 1988 (scrapped)
360 GLT B200F MT5 (302) 230000kms 1988
343 L Junior B14.3E MT4 (155) 229000kms 1981 (scrapped)
343 DLS B19A MT4 (155) 167900kms 1982
360 GL Injection B200F MT5 (231) 348598kms 1988 (scrapped)
360 GLT B200F MT5 (302) 230000kms 1988
-
- Posts: 1921
- Joined: 06 Dec 2008 09:35 pm
- Location: Netherlands.
- Contact:
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
well, i see more than enough of those in holland too Tom (and imo each one is one too many)
-
- *** V3M DONOR ***
- Posts: 1204
- Joined: 27 Jul 2004 11:36 pm
- Location: Belper, Derbyshire UK
- Contact:
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
Update!
Day 1
New thread insert fitted - err, no, it won't fit.
Bugger!
Hmmm, the plug thread in the head seems to be knackered.
Bugger x2.
Ok, time for a new head.
Problem, spare head is off a 4E so will need waterpump and rear plate swapping over.
Bigger problem, spare head has damaged valves and worn stem seals.
Oh well, we'll just have to re-con the head using parts off the old one.
Right, we have our freshened up head ready, it goes back on, it's gone dark.........
Day 2
Finish off fitting stuff, fire it up.
It works!
It's leaking water from the waterpump, bugger!
Ok, wasserpumpen off, re-con all the gaskets, re-fit.
It starts, it works, it doesn't leak! Hurrah!!!
Right, time for an oil change and coolant change.
Coolant change goes fine.
Oil filter seems welded to the block, time for the large screwdriver through the middle ploy.
Right, that's the oil filter off, time for the sump plug.
Plug comes out, complete with most of the thread missing and parts of the sump insert.
Bugger!
So next weekend we have to fit another sump.........
We did actually do the sump plug before we did the oil filter but it doesn't make for quite such and interesting story!!
Day 1
New thread insert fitted - err, no, it won't fit.
Bugger!
Hmmm, the plug thread in the head seems to be knackered.
Bugger x2.
Ok, time for a new head.
Problem, spare head is off a 4E so will need waterpump and rear plate swapping over.
Bigger problem, spare head has damaged valves and worn stem seals.
Oh well, we'll just have to re-con the head using parts off the old one.
Right, we have our freshened up head ready, it goes back on, it's gone dark.........
Day 2
Finish off fitting stuff, fire it up.
It works!
It's leaking water from the waterpump, bugger!
Ok, wasserpumpen off, re-con all the gaskets, re-fit.
It starts, it works, it doesn't leak! Hurrah!!!
Right, time for an oil change and coolant change.
Coolant change goes fine.
Oil filter seems welded to the block, time for the large screwdriver through the middle ploy.
Right, that's the oil filter off, time for the sump plug.
Plug comes out, complete with most of the thread missing and parts of the sump insert.
Bugger!
So next weekend we have to fit another sump.........
We did actually do the sump plug before we did the oil filter but it doesn't make for quite such and interesting story!!
Terms and conditions apply. This post may go down as well as up. Regulated by the Financial Services Authority. Hard hats to be worn. No reversing without a banksman. No admittance to unauthorized persons. Stop that. Put that down. Leave that alone.
-
- *** V3M DONOR ***
- Posts: 1204
- Joined: 27 Jul 2004 11:36 pm
- Location: Belper, Derbyshire UK
- Contact:
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
Yet more updates!!!
Day 1
Foggy arrives at 4.30pm (3.5hrs late) and announces he has to leave by 6.30 as he's due at a function in Nottingham.
Old sump removed accompanied by much cursing and swearing as the Anti-Roll Bar and steering rack have to be removed to gain clearance.
New sump offered up and lightly held in place by 4 bolts.
Foggy buggers off.
Day 2
Sump fitted properly, ARB and rack re-instated.
Oil poured into engine, no obvious leaks.
Engine started and runs sweetly.
Car departs on test run.
Car returns running rough.
Car is breathing very heavily.
Car has thick mayo on filler cap, inside rocker cover and dipstick.
Coolant reservoir now empty.
Bugger, bugger, bugger and bugger.
Time for a cuppa and a think.
Re-emerge to whip head off again as suspect head gasket has failed.
No obvious signs of damage to head, gasket, block or liners.
Bugger.
Current thoughts are,
a) the head needed a skim ( this wasn't done, possibly foolishly) or more likely
b) Rupert pipes up 'Do B14 heads need retorquing at all?' Foggy; 'Not that I know of, I didn't notice it in the Haynes book of lies.'
This is quite true, the section on re-fitting the head says bolt it down and do the bolts up in 2 stages, the torque setting pages just says tighten all to setting 1 then re tighten to setting 2.
However.........., right at the end of the whole section about engine repair it gives advice on what to do after re-assembly and this says to start it up, let it warm up, switch off, allow to cool for 2.5hrs THEN remove rocker cover, slacken head bolts 30* and retighten to stage 2 torque setting!
Bugger x 4000............
Day 1
Foggy arrives at 4.30pm (3.5hrs late) and announces he has to leave by 6.30 as he's due at a function in Nottingham.
Old sump removed accompanied by much cursing and swearing as the Anti-Roll Bar and steering rack have to be removed to gain clearance.
New sump offered up and lightly held in place by 4 bolts.
Foggy buggers off.
Day 2
Sump fitted properly, ARB and rack re-instated.
Oil poured into engine, no obvious leaks.
Engine started and runs sweetly.
Car departs on test run.
Car returns running rough.
Car is breathing very heavily.
Car has thick mayo on filler cap, inside rocker cover and dipstick.
Coolant reservoir now empty.
Bugger, bugger, bugger and bugger.
Time for a cuppa and a think.
Re-emerge to whip head off again as suspect head gasket has failed.
No obvious signs of damage to head, gasket, block or liners.
Bugger.
Current thoughts are,
a) the head needed a skim ( this wasn't done, possibly foolishly) or more likely
b) Rupert pipes up 'Do B14 heads need retorquing at all?' Foggy; 'Not that I know of, I didn't notice it in the Haynes book of lies.'
This is quite true, the section on re-fitting the head says bolt it down and do the bolts up in 2 stages, the torque setting pages just says tighten all to setting 1 then re tighten to setting 2.
However.........., right at the end of the whole section about engine repair it gives advice on what to do after re-assembly and this says to start it up, let it warm up, switch off, allow to cool for 2.5hrs THEN remove rocker cover, slacken head bolts 30* and retighten to stage 2 torque setting!
Bugger x 4000............
Terms and conditions apply. This post may go down as well as up. Regulated by the Financial Services Authority. Hard hats to be worn. No reversing without a banksman. No admittance to unauthorized persons. Stop that. Put that down. Leave that alone.
-
- *** V3M DONOR ***
- Posts: 9143
- Joined: 11 Nov 2008 04:22 pm
- Location: Newcastle Upon Toon
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
This thread is really starting to sound like it was written by me.
Poor luck gents.
Friday the 13th strikes late and true.
Poor luck gents.
Friday the 13th strikes late and true.
-
- Posts: 1921
- Joined: 06 Dec 2008 09:35 pm
- Location: Netherlands.
- Contact:
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
naa, retightening isn't nescarary; i've certanly never done that with a B14.
i'm not sure about the figures; but i believe stage 1 is 30Nm and stage 2 60Nm
did you got the sequence right? bolt no1 is nearest to distributor; opposite to that is no2 and the rest is around the clock, that is quite important for tightening.
how did you remove the head; just pulled it off or first got all the 10 bolts a bit loose and gave it a good horizotal smack with the (soft)hammer first so the liners let go of the head?
could be the seals that seal the liners and block are busted, this makes coolant get into the oil.
i'm not sure about the figures; but i believe stage 1 is 30Nm and stage 2 60Nm
did you got the sequence right? bolt no1 is nearest to distributor; opposite to that is no2 and the rest is around the clock, that is quite important for tightening.
how did you remove the head; just pulled it off or first got all the 10 bolts a bit loose and gave it a good horizotal smack with the (soft)hammer first so the liners let go of the head?
could be the seals that seal the liners and block are busted, this makes coolant get into the oil.
-
- *** V3M DONOR ***
- Posts: 1204
- Joined: 27 Jul 2004 11:36 pm
- Location: Belper, Derbyshire UK
- Contact:
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
They were tightened in the correct sequence, and the head was smacked sideways to break the seal, not lifted directly off. The bolts were also tightened to (if memory serves) 27Nm and then again to 60Nm. the funny thing is that when we came to remove the head the 2nd time the bolts undid very easily with a ratchet, no need for a breaker bar as is usually the case. This is what makes me suspect they really did need re-torquing.
Terms and conditions apply. This post may go down as well as up. Regulated by the Financial Services Authority. Hard hats to be worn. No reversing without a banksman. No admittance to unauthorized persons. Stop that. Put that down. Leave that alone.
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
Total bugger what a pain in the arse I reckon I'd be giving that head a skim too to make sure, AFAIK it's not really too expensive a job
1989 - Volvo 360 GLT
1985 - Volvo 360 GLS
2008 - Volvo S60 SE Lux
1985 - Volvo 360 GLS
2008 - Volvo S60 SE Lux
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
Did you clean and oil the bolts before installing?
Oiling the bolts is important as otherwise torque is not set correctly, too much friction, but I guess you know that already.
Even it is bit of extra work, might be good to have thick straight glass where you could check if head is straight or not, dark glass is easier than clear, imo. That way one can rather easily evaluate if head needs shimming or not, gap checking tool is also helpful in process.
Such glass is very useful for many other tasks too, like straightening carb sealing surfaces etc. I don't know if it would be possible to shim head if you have enough large glass and glued wet sand paper over glass, might work out, however it is only 20-30(?) to get it shimmed properly.
Cracks not visible to eye are always possible, but maybe not likely, those can start to leak when engine is warmed up, however with B14 I really doubt about those.
Oiling the bolts is important as otherwise torque is not set correctly, too much friction, but I guess you know that already.
Even it is bit of extra work, might be good to have thick straight glass where you could check if head is straight or not, dark glass is easier than clear, imo. That way one can rather easily evaluate if head needs shimming or not, gap checking tool is also helpful in process.
Such glass is very useful for many other tasks too, like straightening carb sealing surfaces etc. I don't know if it would be possible to shim head if you have enough large glass and glued wet sand paper over glass, might work out, however it is only 20-30(?) to get it shimmed properly.
Cracks not visible to eye are always possible, but maybe not likely, those can start to leak when engine is warmed up, however with B14 I really doubt about those.
-
- Posts: 1921
- Joined: 06 Dec 2008 09:35 pm
- Location: Netherlands.
- Contact:
Re: The stop-gap: 1980 (mk1) 345 DL
only a really; really tiny ammount of oil or you get a wrong setting too.
holes aren't all the way through the block so oil can seal the space under it and you'll create a sort of hydrau-lock when torquing the bolts.
if the head goes off to be skimmed, i'd do a pressurisationtest first; a crack in the head is a possibility, especcially with the condition the head was in in the first place.
holes aren't all the way through the block so oil can seal the space under it and you'll create a sort of hydrau-lock when torquing the bolts.
if the head goes off to be skimmed, i'd do a pressurisationtest first; a crack in the head is a possibility, especcially with the condition the head was in in the first place.