I wish I could turn the clock back and buy a decent car

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djntrap
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I wish I could turn the clock back and buy a decent car

Post by djntrap » 27 Apr 2012 07:59 am

What a load of shit. Had my 340 for about 6 months now and everything breaks. Even when you fix it something else breaks. It's a fucking money pit and I hate it. No, loathe it. It's a piece of shit I can never find parts for (even if I can people ask way too much) gone are the days I used to mock my friend for spending 6k on an ae86 when I spent a grand and had more power. His car looks a million times better, actually handles, doesn't break every day and he hasn't had to throw nearly 2k at it just to keep it alive! Seriously, if you want a fun car but think you can get away with being a cheapskate and buying one of these hunks of shite, save the extra grand and buy something different. Anyway rant over. I'll now continue my hunt for a prop so I can sell the fucking thing before I take a hammer to it

Evoman
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Re: I wish I could turn the clock back and buy a decent car

Post by Evoman » 27 Apr 2012 09:22 am

We are truly sorry for your poor experience
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Chris_C
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Re: I wish I could turn the clock back and buy a decent car

Post by Chris_C » 27 Apr 2012 11:08 am

They are never going to be a cheap car to try and use for any motorsport. I've tried saying it on this forum before, but the amount of custom work and money I've had to put into mine to get it to take the power it's running (which, lets be honest, is only just above 80's hot hatch level, it's nothing special) is huge.

People need to remember the 340 is based around a DAF 66. A car that at it's peak made 65ish bhp. The fact things had to be uprated to fit the 1.7 block says a huge amount, yet you still see people running valvers on the pressed tin 1.4 engine mounts (yes, the 1.7 ones are stronger for a reason, it's not just to clear the clutch arm).

Plus, at their youngest, they are 21 years old, so all the mounts at both ends of the car are knackered anyway as no one will change them even if they were available. Those who service cars only do engine bay, hardly ever rubber parts.

The cheapest way of having a fast car is to buy a fast car. Even an AE86 is pretty damn slow out the box, it's a family hatch. £2500 on an S14 is a much better bet, but again people insist of mucking about with them to make them more unreliable.

Standard 340s are one of *the* most reliable cars I know of. I've run several. Standard car triangle:

-----Cost-----------
Power----Reliability

You can have any two from the triangle, never three.
'89(G) 340 GLE B172k
'03 S60 D5 SE, '91 (J) MX5, 1954 Cyclemaster
Ex:
'89(F) 340 GL F7R (ex B172k) - Fake -> SBKV 300 Runner Up 08, 12; '91(H) 340 GL B14.4E - Kar; '88(F) 360 GLT B200E - Jet -> BKV 300 Runner Up 09; '89(G) 360 GLT B200E - Beast

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jon-ovlov
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Re: I wish I could turn the clock back and buy a decent car

Post by jon-ovlov » 27 Apr 2012 11:37 am

I can understand why you're angry. At one point with mine, I was getting so many alternator problems it was dire! Managed to solve it eventually though, and carried on through. It's a shame, because looking at your videos on YT, the car and you seem very capable! Remember your mate had to fork out 6 grand in the first place. I built my F7R 340 for I'd say around 1500, including the price of the car. Fraction of the price, and I had a lot of fun doing it and now driving it. The HG went recently, but that could happen to any car. I've had to check the engine alignment for the sake of the prop, but now all is peachy.

Owning a drift car, no matter what it is, things break. They always will. It's a very strenuous motor-sport for a car. If you look at a lot of drift cars, they've all had to be re-done in some way. Even BMW's can crap themselves, but there's a shed load of them around, and parts are easily available. Drifting is never a sport you are going to be able to do for peanuts, but it can be done for less than any other sport. You have to be prepared to spend the money if you want to upgrade bits, in the 340's case its getting custom bits made. Front coil-overs are around 350 for the fronts. A proper ae86 set-up is around 400-600 quid depending on what you go for, so it all pans out. There are easier routes, but that's boring!

Chris also makes a valid point, they were never designed to be anything near the power the F7s put out. You modify ANYTHING, it will become less reliable. If you are going to swap, go for a BMW E36 or similar. Simple power increases and german engineering. Take a good look before you buy it though, could be a hornets nest.
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jtbo
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Re: I wish I could turn the clock back and buy a decent car

Post by jtbo » 27 Apr 2012 02:20 pm

Problem is that cars were too cheap to begin with, so they were 2nd cars not cared much after, just used and disposed, some elderly drivers bought them too, they still knew how to keep things lasting 40 years, they did live before consumption mayhem, but that starts to be lost knowledge, kids buy these cars use them like stole them and then sell them with low mileage cars that have driven to point they need major restoration.

Manufacturers service program is bare minimum, skipping from that will result problems, to keep car truly in good working order more is needed, just about everything has designed life that it will last 100%, usually bits can last even double from that, but to keep car 100% reliable one must not wait fault to occur to replace things. That is basics of good car care and it does cost a ton.

99% thinks car being reliable when it will go forever with only oil changes, but that in reality is just how well car can take abuse.

Now think about this modern crap made after 95 or so, just wait until those come to age of 300 series, there will be a ton of issues, so much more bits to replace which are all thinner and more fragile, you need to dismantle half of the car to get access to some bits, but everything it attached with use once type of hooks that fail.

For example. for my french crap, I needed to replace windshield wiper relay, Instructions were, remove the dashboard, I took instrument cluster out to find there is solid plastic behind it, so I punched a hole to plastic to gain easy access to all relays. Now big difference with 300 is that you don't need to do such things, there is less parts to take care of, but you need to replace them after certain time or/and after certain mileage, previous owners have not done that, I can say that almost 100% sure, because how society has become and how we are taught use once, dispose buy more new more eco, so old methods of good servicing are forgotten.

I have battery drill from 80's, it still beats most of those attractive packaging versions, it has been taken care of, new brushes, battery, I think that even bearings are done once. Oh yes, you could do that to old ones, forget servicing newer ones. Actually that battery drill was first to appear in market, Fein.

Problem is that attitude we are taught, how new would be better than old, how caring fro old is not 'cool' or whatever, so when we who like from old buy used vehicle it will be crap, it is just some base that is needed to be worked with.

My recipe has been that when I buy car for daily driving, I add at least car's price to first year servicing, up to twice the price of the car might be needed as previous owners might have been skipping servicing, for example my french crap had full book of service records, but I had to replace most of the bushings at front, exhaust, brakes (discs, pads, drums, shoes, handbrake cable, everything) oil was thick, oil filter was rusty, air filter was so thick of soot that it had 2mm thick layer of it on side were air enters to filter, some bearings have needed replacing and there are lot of things that have not been working, like heater fan and windshield wiper except fast speeds, it still has some I have decided not to fix, like headlamp washers, radiator e-fan, central locking etc. Have had rust holes, sills needed to be made from scratch, starter motor failed, even alternator belt failed and I did bring it to garage so they can replace that at 6 months before it failed, so that tells something about quality of servicing when you buy servicing from some garage.

So only way to know state of the car is to work by yourself with it and do everything during first year of ownership, replace everything that in theory can fail.

After that comes rust proofing, which can take even more money in old car, there will be welding even in spotless car, there is always some place, full underside cleaning would be needed, underseal and all that after that.

Only after then car is in known state and can be started to cared after to keep that good state of car, but this all cost a lot and takes lot of time, also workplace and tools, so it is quite difficult to make happen, but that is only way to get car to shape it was originally and to know if car is truly reliable or not by design and by model.

32 year old car that was last one I bought will require quite a bit of work to become good one, there are so many things wrong with it still, but eventually I think that it will be done by this principle and I can say it is in good condition.

Then there is modifying and abusing of vehicle (using it in motorsports), car was designed to be shopping car for families, more or less, it was designed to have 1.4l motor and CVT transmission, never it was designed to be cornered on race track or driven at autobahns with gazillion mph.
That means that car needs to be modified, factory did some modifications to make 2ltr motors usable in car, but despite their efforts there are bits that are not too strong, so to make car take something as stressing as drifting without failing, you would need to change whole lot of things, from engine mounts, to suspension arms, rear axles, gearbox and differential are no good either, even they might last some time, they really are not such that would last long in such stressing conditions, driveshafts and their joints are also way too weak, even body need to be made stronger.

Point is to make car do things it was not designed to do, you need to redesign the car to new task, which needs then replacing most of bits there is and making body stronger, or else things will fail.

There is reason why racing parts are made, they are lot stronger than standard parts, even with BMW 300 series which is made for more power to begin with, there are bits that fail unless made to withstand actual realizing of that power for such as drifting or rallying.

Every mounting should be made a lot stronger is thing to begin with.

Again it will cost a lot, but when you look those cars that are actually redesigned for motorsport use, there is high price tag with them and they still will fail, just not so often and it will take quite bit more to make them fail.

Disappointment comes from faulty assumption most of the time, realizing assumption has been faulty generates chance to find new ways to make hoped characteristics possible. There are several routes, easiest might be selling the car and getting something biased more towards motorsports to begin with, but as has been said that is easy boring way, well not very easy and certainly not much cheaper either + settling back with average status with no chance to be different. One could also sit back and look whole picture, what has been done, what has been failing, what there is left to fail and then just start planning budget that would make car to be what one assumed in first place.

Any project should be started with planning budget and staying with the budget, without that it just ends badly for the car and for the enthusiasts.

Problem is that we live on illusion created by our minds + marketing and are not taught how to face reality, so it is easy to underestimate costs and overestimate rest.

This is at least what I have gathered from things during the tens of years, but most of these are just my minds illusions naturally, which might differ from your illusions, but for individual their own illusions are true until bubble is burst :lol:
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MCHUDD
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Re: I wish I could turn the clock back and buy a decent car

Post by MCHUDD » 27 Apr 2012 05:29 pm

Hi mate.
Sorry your having a bad time with the motor but if you think of all the 300s that competed in
rallys in the 70s and 80s, they were set up for that porpose. All the road cars like ours were not, so they will probably
break easier.{old fart wisdom rant over :lol: }.
Good luck. Cheers Mark.
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Evoman
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Re: I wish I could turn the clock back and buy a decent car

Post by Evoman » 27 Apr 2012 06:32 pm

I have done 10,000 miles in my car I have done:

Water Pump
Fuel Pump
All Belts
Radiator
Exhaust
Coil, Plugs, lead, dizzy cap and rotor arm.
New shocks
2 New spring cups
and Head Gasket

In 10,000 miles, one years use, that seems alot to me! It broke down twice, drinks feul, gave me speeding ticket when misfireing (too busy worrying about that than the speed limit) but I still love it.
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Ride_on
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Re: I wish I could turn the clock back and buy a decent car

Post by Ride_on » 28 Apr 2012 04:38 pm

Enjoying cars of this age are pretty much down to the skill of the owner, its never going to be plug and play. You have to get a good car and keep in good condition and expect to overhaul parts or full systems that have worn out/broken. These do last longer than most though and can take a fair bit of abuse, but they were never designed to last this long. If someone else has used up the car, its not the cars fault.
1980 345 DL_______1987 360 GLE (project car restored to GLT spec and B230FT'd)
1984 360 GLT______1987 360 GLT
1983 360 GLS______1989 360 GLE
1985 340 GL_______1986 340 1.4
1985 360 GLS______1995 940 SE 2.3 Turbo Estate (daily)
1987 340 GL 1.7

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williswoody
Posts: 102
Joined: 02 Oct 2011 10:55 am
Location: Queensland, Australia

Re: I wish I could turn the clock back and buy a decent car

Post by williswoody » 06 May 2012 09:25 am

I've had my 360GLT since about October last year (cause I'm 17, and apparently I drive it like I stole it) and so far I've done about 7,000kms on it.

What's happened to me:
* a month after I bought it, hit a massive bump too fast, and cause the fuel pump to leak. Needed replacing.
* hit a roo in the front, lost the right fog light (though this isn't really a massive issue)
* radiator started leaking and needed fixing.
* fuel pump relay acting silly, causing the car to stall in traffic, managed to get it going again, and bunny hop out of the road.
* replacing the fuel filter, which contained random bits of plastic in it, causing problems with the fuel supply.
* driving in extremely wet conditions, with puddles everywhere, and again broke down in traffic. got it going again, bunny hopped out of the road, had to call RACQ road assistance, who sprayed Water-Resistant spray into the distributor, and it worked fine again.

I would also just like to say that there are so many annoying design flaws on this car. Like why is the fuel pump in a vulnerable area, at the bottom of the car, where it could easily get hit with a stone or something and leak (yeah, mounting pads there, I know, but still, couldn't it be under the hood instead?) and the distributor being right at the front behind the radiator, where water can easily get into it??

I still love it anyway, and at the moment, it drive fine :) just need air conditioning, stereo/antenna to be fixed (only get static :S), new fog light & front dint pulled out.

:D
1984 VOLVO 360 GLT HATCH Owner. First car. Aussie. Uncertain of it, after it's started playing up lately :/

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