Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shocker

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S10NPH
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Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shocker

Post by S10NPH » 02 Jun 2013 10:11 pm

I took BHX to its first ever show today, the Norwich Classic Vehicle Club annual fun day. I was invited by Les, the chap who restored my car, who wanted to have my car there to show off his work. I wasn't expecting much, but I was completely wrong! It was a brilliant show, loads of great cars, and a very professional event. Anyway, here are a few pictures:

BHX all polished and back-to-blacked to within an inch of its life:
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I found a couple of friendly DAFs to park next to:
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I really liked this battered MK5 Cortina Estate:
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This Fiat 500 was completely bonkers:
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Very smart Austin Ambassador:
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A couple of other Volvos:
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There were loads of Marinas and Itals there, this one being by far the smartest, and possibly my favourite car in the show:
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I also really liked this poverty spec '85 Escort 1.1 Popular:
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I don't normally like sports cars or Japanese cars, but this Toyota ST2000 was lovely:
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As was this Starlet:
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Nice mk1 Metro, shame it's an MG not a poverty spec with vinyl seats and no headrests, but can't have it all:
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Same comments re this mk1 Fiesta:
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Smart early 2CV import:
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1977 Volvo 343 DL 1.4 Vario TUJ 247R
1980 Volvo 345 DL 1.4 PGH 590V
1981 Volvo 345 DL 1.4 ECR 312W
1985 Volvo 340 DL 1.4 Vario B168 DTU
1982 Volvo 245 GLT 2.3 Auto VKN 137X
1997 Saab 900 Convertible P290 DDF and 2018 VW Tiguan S10 NPH

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S10NPH
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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by S10NPH » 02 Jun 2013 10:34 pm

Oh also meant to say that today's journey from Cambridge to Norwich to North Walsham to Cambridge (156 miles) was the longest I've taken it by far, and it behaved very well. The temperature gauge was on 'N' when travelling at a constant 60ish, and rested at about 1/3 at speeds below that. It only used half a tank of fuel too, my fuelly signature will update next time I fuel up. The car is also pinking quite a bit, which is strange. As I've replaced all the ignition parts and adjusted the points correctly, I can only guess that the mixture may be too rich, I will need to adjust it at some point.

The dashboard clock is also temperamental, which is a bit of a pain, I will have to give the contacts a clean at the back at some stage.
1977 Volvo 343 DL 1.4 Vario TUJ 247R
1980 Volvo 345 DL 1.4 PGH 590V
1981 Volvo 345 DL 1.4 ECR 312W
1985 Volvo 340 DL 1.4 Vario B168 DTU
1982 Volvo 245 GLT 2.3 Auto VKN 137X
1997 Saab 900 Convertible P290 DDF and 2018 VW Tiguan S10 NPH

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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by thebear54 » 02 Jun 2013 10:58 pm

Brilliant......

A beautiful day for this great event. Glad to see Matt Roberts there with "Dorothy" the red 44 Estate.

Your 343 looks fantastic! 340pw

John
DAF CLUB of AMERICA Director & DAF MUSEUM-USA Director

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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by Chris_C » 03 Jun 2013 07:51 am

Image
You can't have missed what is next to it!?

Re pinking. It will be lean, rather than rich if this really is the case, does it have a proper dizzy or Renix? Could be the dizzy is rotated to far advanced? Do B14's of this age require full fat petrol?
'89(F) 340 GL F7R (ex B172k) - Fake -> SBKV 300 Runner Up 08, 12 - NASLR Time 15.7secs
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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by MCHUDD » 03 Jun 2013 09:47 am

Hi Sion.
Love that winedy up thing on the back of that 500 :lol: :lol: :lol:
Car looks stunning.
Cheers Mark.
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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by S10NPH » 03 Jun 2013 01:38 pm

Chris_C wrote:You can't have missed what is next to it!?
No I didn't, I will put up a closer picture when I get home.
Chris_C wrote:Re pinking. It will be lean, rather than rich if this really is the case, does it have a proper dizzy or Renix? Could be the dizzy is rotated to far advanced? Do B14's of this age require full fat petrol?
Hmph, I think I will need to investigate this further. The car has a proper dizzy, no modern Renix here thank you! It does require full fat petrol from a discussion previously on this forum, so that's what I use. On startup with full choke, even from really cold, it starts within half a second, and roars strongly to life such that the choke immediately has to go halfway in. On acceleration, there's a definite rough-sounding gurgle, which disappears once a constant speed is reached, which I have attributed to pinking but may be wrong. Mac has previously adjusted engine speed down and I think it's about right now, though could still probably go down a fraction again. Unfortunately the timing light I borrow is somewhat temperamental. I haven't as yet adjusted the mixture, to me it doesn't feel like it's struggling for fuel, and neither is it over-rich with no petrol smell coming from the exhaust and the spark plugs looked healthy when I replaced them a few weeks ago.
1977 Volvo 343 DL 1.4 Vario TUJ 247R
1980 Volvo 345 DL 1.4 PGH 590V
1981 Volvo 345 DL 1.4 ECR 312W
1985 Volvo 340 DL 1.4 Vario B168 DTU
1982 Volvo 245 GLT 2.3 Auto VKN 137X
1997 Saab 900 Convertible P290 DDF and 2018 VW Tiguan S10 NPH

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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by Chris_C » 03 Jun 2013 02:00 pm

I've seen pinking described lots of ways, from birds chirpy to things rattling in the engine. It's a high pitched metallic noise, sharp on the ears like several little taps. Most likely to occur under full throttle large load, say if you are in fifth going up a hill and go for an overtake without changing down.
'89(F) 340 GL F7R (ex B172k) - Fake -> SBKV 300 Runner Up 08, 12 - NASLR Time 15.7secs
'03 S60 D5 SE, '91 (J) MX5
Ex:
'91(H) 340 GL B14.4E - Kar; '88(F) 360 GLT B200E - Jet -> BKV 300 Runner Up 09; '89(G) 360 GLT B200E - Beast

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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by jtbo » 03 Jun 2013 05:48 pm

Chris_C wrote:I've seen pinking described lots of ways, from birds chirpy to things rattling in the engine. It's a high pitched metallic noise, sharp on the ears like several little taps. Most likely to occur under full throttle large load, say if you are in fifth going up a hill and go for an overtake without changing down.
It is bit like Rice Crsipies from Kellog's when you pour milk in it, but more metallic, not very loud and indeed under heavier load but can happen relatively light load too, which could be when dizzy advances too much under light load, but is proper on heavier load.

Dropping of nails also describes pinking a bit, but it is not very loud, I would say it is bit thin sound, kind of metal against metal, clapping keys against have some similarity too (in quite fast fashion). I got some experience from the sound when playing around with Megasquirt, adjusting to pinking and then backing off a bit when I did ignition mapping :D

If it goes away immediately when backing off from throttle a bit it is quite solid proof.

Vacuum assist of dizzy maybe could act up?

Just guessing really, not so much experience from these earlier type of motors.


I did see pic of 343 and though that is really nice car, without realizing what car it was, so big transformation, wheels do a lot of it of course.
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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by Chris_C » 03 Jun 2013 07:15 pm

jtbo wrote:It is bit like Rice Crsipies from Kellog's when you pour milk in it, but more metallic, not very loud and indeed under heavier load but can happen relatively light load too, which could be when dizzy advances too much under light load, but is proper on heavier load.
Great description, I'll be borrowing that when trying to explain to people! It really is like Rice Crispies but a nadge more metallic.
'89(F) 340 GL F7R (ex B172k) - Fake -> SBKV 300 Runner Up 08, 12 - NASLR Time 15.7secs
'03 S60 D5 SE, '91 (J) MX5
Ex:
'91(H) 340 GL B14.4E - Kar; '88(F) 360 GLT B200E - Jet -> BKV 300 Runner Up 09; '89(G) 360 GLT B200E - Beast

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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by MCHUDD » 03 Jun 2013 07:45 pm

Hi Lads.
What about tappets.
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Cheers Mark.

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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by jtbo » 03 Jun 2013 08:02 pm

Chris_C wrote: Great description, I'll be borrowing that when trying to explain to people! It really is like Rice Crispies but a nadge more metallic.
Also pouring nails to metal bucket is close, but not to empty metal bucket and one should not pour too fast!

I think that tappets are most heard at idle, not so much under load, but that is area where I have not too much experience and my memories are bit faint from issues around tappets.

Sound of tappets is different, more of old clock crunching time away than pinking and tappets are more rpm than load sensitive, imo.
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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by V6 Man » 03 Jun 2013 09:15 pm

I've always found that with old fashioned 'points and carb' arrangements to old school methods work fine. whilst timing lights and vac tubes are great for ultra fine tuning of timing and mixture you can get damn close by setting the static timing and then the mixture by ear.

If (and I can't be arsed to look it up) my memory serves....

Connect a lamp between the Low Voltage feed to the Dizzy and the Dizzy.
Get the engine to TDC on No1 pot and turn ign on.
Loosen Dizzy clamp and rotate Dizzy anti-clockwise until lamp goes out. If already out ignore.
Rotate Dizzy clockwise until lamp lights.
Rotate Dizzy until anti-clockwise until lamp just goes out.
Tighten clamps on Dizzy.

Static timing is now set.

Run car until engine is at normal operating temp.
Turn mixture screw until it's idling as fast as it goes.
Adjust Idle speed down to normal.
Job done!

You have now set both timing and mixture to as near as damnit the optimum that can be done by an amateur with no diagnostic equipment.
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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by Hell Driver » 03 Jun 2013 09:17 pm

Gurgle does not sound like a description of pinking to me.

The car looks great now, well worth the work.

I get pinking in the 360 if pressed hard uphill. I suspect lack of leaded petrol may be the problem. I do need to check the timimg first though as it's mechanical.
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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by S10NPH » 03 Jun 2013 11:12 pm

S10NPH wrote:
Chris_C wrote:You can't have missed what is next to it!?
No I didn't, I will put up a closer picture when I get home.
As promised:
Image

I think your description of pinking is what is happening to my car, Jani. Metallic Rice Crispies is pretty accurate, it's not very loud but discernable. It goes away once I ease off the throttle. When I next get a chance, I will play around with the timing and the mixture and see if it gets better.
1977 Volvo 343 DL 1.4 Vario TUJ 247R
1980 Volvo 345 DL 1.4 PGH 590V
1981 Volvo 345 DL 1.4 ECR 312W
1985 Volvo 340 DL 1.4 Vario B168 DTU
1982 Volvo 245 GLT 2.3 Auto VKN 137X
1997 Saab 900 Convertible P290 DDF and 2018 VW Tiguan S10 NPH

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Re: Norwich Classic Vehicle show 2013 - non 300 content shoc

Post by jtbo » 04 Jun 2013 03:38 pm

Talbot Horizont with Lotus bagde, never heard of that one!

I know that such Talbot was sold in US and they had some quite quick turbo version made, it had completely different name which I have forgotten already.

I wanted such Starlet as first car, but I could afford only Tercel, I still would like to own such Starlet, small economical RWD which has enough space for my current needs. 300 is bit heavy compared to those.
Volvo 360GL -88 -under restoration-
Volvo 343DL vario -81 -running- Image
Volvo 240 Diesel -83 -undecided-
Citroen ZX Dturbo -97 -daily- ImageImage

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