Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Brakes

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CBA
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Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Brakes

Post by CBA » 15 Oct 2013 06:58 am

I'm taking something back as "not fit for purpose" and "Did not last as long as could reasonably be expected" by a lot.
Namely, scooter brake cable. It's only lasted 1500 miles. I know I'm protected under comsumer rights, just need the expert opinion so it's a *SOLID* claim.

Damn dangerous... this shop's selling unsafe chinese pieceofshit cables, I'm not happy about it. this is the third cable in about a year.

CBA
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Re: Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Br

Post by CBA » 15 Oct 2013 07:45 am

We're talkng a £20 refund, it's not my refund though.... :oops: , cable snapped on ME - theres a dispute HELP!
I don't want to have to fight over £20 but you know how stubborn some people are. Shop should budge easily, just want backup RE: expert opinion. 10 seconds of your time:

1. Cable was fitted correctly.
2. Bike is stored indoors.
3. 1500 miles
4. Lucky it snapped at side of road and not ON the road

volvomania
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Re: Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Br

Post by volvomania » 15 Oct 2013 07:55 am

Just a few questions:
How long ago did you buy the cable? Do you still have proof of purchase?
Who fitted the cable?

I believe that you are only protected for a certain period.
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Chris_C
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Re: Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Br

Post by Chris_C » 15 Oct 2013 08:57 am

volvomania wrote:Who fitted the cable?
Quite.

Does this person possess expert training or equivalent experience in the field of expertise? (i.e. fully passed out apprentice mechanic or has worked in a garage on bikes for 5+ years?)

I'd suggest they might swap you a new cable out of good relations, but I'd not expect them to feel they have to unless *at least* the above is met, along with a full record of maintenance (does Scooter manufacturer suggest cable checks ever x miles? Are these recorded?)
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Ride_on
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Re: Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Br

Post by Ride_on » 15 Oct 2013 03:50 pm

Would the installation have any bearing on the life of the item?

I'm not 100% upto date in the latest sale of goods and it may not have been introduced yet, but I have studied the old one quite carefully.

1. For the first 6 months it is up to the supplier to prove that its not their fault, you misused it etc. After that you have 6 years to prove the item was unfit for the purpose, and that can be difficult, you need an Engineers report that explains how the item was incorectly designed or constructed.

2. Your contract is with the person you paid to buy and fit the cable, you have no contract with the cable seller (unless you actually bought it from them). They owe you nothing.

Generally my experience with mechanics is that they have not clue about the law, and the ones i have dealt with there is not a chance in hell they will replace parts that don't last 'you got what you paid for mate'. This is why I do my own work.

The new sales of goods apparently does away with the 6 year claim, and imposed a mandatory guarantee of 2 years. That was the last time I looked at the proposal, and I didn't think that would do much for quality.

I have found that quoting the legal text is very powerful, if they have a legal dept, you get what you want right away, and if not you are scaring the person.

So if the job failed, go back to the mechanic that did it and ask him to sort it for free. If he tells you the part only has xx warranty, just say that ok I want it fixed under the Sale of Goods and services act. If it was a mate then go back to the shop and claim you bought it, preferably with proof of purchase (bank statement, invoice, receipt etc).

If they refuse, I think you can initiate a small claims case over the web in England, although it will cost you a bit more than £20, but not a huge amount. Might be a good project.
1980 345 DL_______1987 360 GLE (project car restored to GLT spec and B230FT'd)
1984 360 GLT______1987 360 GLT
1983 360 GLS______1989 360 GLE
1985 340 GL_______1986 340 1.4
1985 360 GLS______1995 940 SE 2.3 Turbo Estate (daily)
1987 340 GL 1.7

CBA
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Re: Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Br

Post by CBA » 16 Oct 2013 12:26 am

It's been less than 6 months. I'm pretty sure the flux they solder the ends on with is caustic and is corroding the cable in ~4 months. From what I can see. Seriously, these cables are crap: it's a supplier issue, not shops fault.

I fit the cable, it was dead on balls right. Its my mates effin bike....

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Re: Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Br

Post by volvomania » 16 Oct 2013 07:58 am

I have to agree with the "run of the mill" mechanic, you get what you pay for.
If you want dirt cheap parts you shouldn't be surprised that they won't fit/last/.....
Ride_on wrote:The new sales of goods apparently does away with the 6 year claim, and imposed a mandatory guarantee of 2 years. That was the last time I looked at the proposal, and I didn't think that would do much for quality.
I never knew goods to have a 6 year warranty (a couple of Japanese makes excepted), over here they just went up from 1 to 2 years.
A common piece of wisdom over here, Belgium, is that cheap "Far Eastern" stuff will not last the warranty period and one doesn't need to expect any warranty on it.
Perhaps it is worth buying some locally made parts next time?
Last edited by volvomania on 17 Oct 2013 07:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Br

Post by macplaxton » 16 Oct 2013 10:05 am

volvomania wrote:I never knew goods to have a 6 year warranty
They don't. It is the limit of statute - the time frame in which a claim under the act can be made.
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Ride_on
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Re: Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Br

Post by Ride_on » 16 Oct 2013 02:14 pm

CBA wrote:it's a supplier issue, not shops fault.
The law does consider that it is the shops fault, its all about who you gave money too. In the real word, manufactuers get very little profit compared to retailers. And morally I also blame the shop, even though they did not intend it, they are not concerned enough with the component quality.

A manufacturers mark up in the volume market is maybe 10-20%, often less for Chinese stuff, retailers charge 100% typically. The shop may have no quality requirements with the supplier, the factory may have supplied parts without guarantee or supplied extra parts to buy out the responsibility.

There is no legal requirement for manufacturers to have any standards on quality or safety, unless they are putting on a label or mark that represents a 3rd party quality scheme like TUV/UL or a legal mark like CE (parts for repair are not normally required to be CE marked).

I hate the way programs like Watchdog go for manufacturers, defects are the retailers responsibility, but tretailers often refer to the manufacturers warranty, but that is over and above the retailers legal responsibility.
1980 345 DL_______1987 360 GLE (project car restored to GLT spec and B230FT'd)
1984 360 GLT______1987 360 GLT
1983 360 GLS______1989 360 GLE
1985 340 GL_______1986 340 1.4
1985 360 GLS______1995 940 SE 2.3 Turbo Estate (daily)
1987 340 GL 1.7

CBA
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Re: Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Br

Post by CBA » 16 Oct 2013 06:13 pm

By no means dirt cheap, £25.00+vat for a 7 foot cable.

So it should last 2 years, reasonably. So 4 months is well-out, and falls under the act? and the shop is responsible for selling the substandard product(as defined in the act-poor quality/not fit for purpose/reasonable longevity) - so a loss is ver-near impossible if taken to court = should be no problem getting an instant resolution :o

Ride_on
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Re: Expert opinion required, must have a qualifictation - Br

Post by Ride_on » 18 Oct 2013 03:44 pm

...Unless the manufacturer specifies it as a service item.

Under the old regulation a TV that didn't last 3 years due to a bad design would be considered faulty at the time of sale, but the retailer only had to compensate you for the remaining life time and you have to prove it (if claiming after 3 months).

Volvo have been a victim of this (as have many car mfr), and tried to claim a 2 -4 year life time for a servo controlled throttle flap in their inlet manifold was reasonable. The judge didn't agree, now after 2 years they can get away with this.
1980 345 DL_______1987 360 GLE (project car restored to GLT spec and B230FT'd)
1984 360 GLT______1987 360 GLT
1983 360 GLS______1989 360 GLE
1985 340 GL_______1986 340 1.4
1985 360 GLS______1995 940 SE 2.3 Turbo Estate (daily)
1987 340 GL 1.7

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