Shoot from the lip...

[Fuse]

Original or built, I like all kinds of cars as long as they are done with some kind of non-retarded idea in mind...

I hate bodgery, zipties, jb-weld, and all kinds of quick solutions to do stuff just because someone is lazy and doesn't want to do it properly, even if in many cases it wouldn't take more time or money to do things properly.

You could say that the ignorance in car scene is the thing I don't like. I my self don't prefer many cars in this tramp drifting scene because in many cases people say "I have a built 300-series", and what they have done is they've scrapped the original interior (usually thrown away, even though there are people who would've quite possibly have a good use for the parts), welded the diff and installed bucket seats.. That's more like riced out 300-series than built 300-series in my opinion. Usually the price tag is also higher after these "modifications".

Using mint condition MK1 and MK2 300-series especially in this manner is totally stupid because there are plenty of beaten up, daily driven 300-series which would serve better this "dispose after use"-style drifting..

I'm not saying that all built cars should only be built with lots of money and resources, not at all because I don't have lots of money for my hobby either. What I'm saying is that you can do many things properly even though you wouldn't have endless amounts of money to use.

Also the image which tramp-drift scene gives out isn't so good as can be seen from the first post of this topic.. Remember, building 300-series isn't a synonym for tramp-drift 300-series.. Also all car enthusiasts aren't drifters.

BUT don't get me wrong, there are many nice cars also in drifting scene. The general atmosphere of this scene is unfortunatelly not something I can relate with.

Drift scene can't be blamed for the lack of original 300-series cars here in Finland though. Most of the 300-series which have been on the road are gone just because of the simple fact that 99% of the 300-series cars in here are in terrible shape, rotten etc... just generally worn out and owners haven't cared to maintain these cars properly in last 20 years or so. Reputation of 300-series haven't been so good so most cars are simply used untill the owner has scrapped them because of a larger failure.

Original shape 300-series are nice as long as they really are in good condition and well kept. A rotted stock 360 with 400k on the meter, busted up interior, faded paint etc... isn't any better or more interesting than a 300-series which is tramp drifted without any sense.

[mrsoundcraft]

I am regularly on this forum and always looking for new threads, with interesting information and pictures of 300 series cars. Whether it be modifications, restorations, cures for running problems or pictures from the past. I find it all very interesting. Although these threads don't come up as often as they do on other forums.
This leads me to believe that the members on here, rightly so, don't live on line and have more important things to be getting on with.

However this post was started yesterday and already it has 4 pages. Its a good thing that many members on here are willing to discuss this issue, although it has sparked more interest than any other post Ive seen on here in a while.

All of this has put me under a great deal of pressure with my original plans for the future of my . I have to thank Volvosneverdie for the mention within this post. Im famous

It would be nice to know how many original examples are still out there, and therefore how important that makes my rust free example in the grand scale of Volvo 340/360 cars in the UK?
Personally I think Max Plaxton's 343 is far more important (the only other car Ive seen).

In an Ideal world I think I would Keep my 340 as is and get another for the track, but that would mean 3 cars on the road! The alternative is taking this one of the road and paying for dry storage. But what would that achieve? I feel a little trapped .

The members on here who are against modifying, and using a 340 as a track car are invited to save this car.

There is no excuse for ignoring this offer as I believe doing so invalidates some of the views expressed in this thread.

[volvosneverdie]

Ha ha ha. I'm sure Tom would love to take it on. If you fancy a drive to Germany.
I wish I had something to swap you mate, I'd love another 300 as a daily while I perform needless engine mods on the GLE.
I don't have anything to give you though, mores the pity.

[Ian Mac]

There is no excuse for ignoring this offer as I believe doing so invalidates some of the views expressed in this thread.

Sorry, I don't agree. I started this thread and I passionately agree with the views I originally stated. However, simple practicalities such as lack of storage space and limited finance due to impending redundancy dictate that I can't accomodate another car but no way does this invalidate my views. This is a bit like saying if no one buys it I'll send it to the scrapyard or part exchange it into the scrappage scheme. I only have one response - go ahead.....

[whiskeyonesix]

If I can add a comment or two...

My MkIII isn't a drift car, nor is it in showroom condition, it is, to be frank, in fairly poor condition. The front is covered in stone chips ( thanks to the terrible roads here ), the paint has faded to a dark pink colour ( courtesy of 24 years under the harsh sunlight ) a lot of the interior trim is fairly loose, and one of the seats needs stitching up.
This is a car that will never be a classic - simply because cars like this aren't viewed as classics here, it will never be worth much, and parts will always be a problem to get, hence very low numbers on the roads here ( I've seen 2 others on the road in a year and a half. )
What my car is though, is cheap reliable individual transport. I don't have a great deal of money, probably like a lot of people on here ( A mortgage on my place in the UK, and helping the wife out with rent and bills here takes care of that ) but I have spent a fair bit on the 300, not making it look good, but by making it as reliable and as long-lasting as I possibly can. The time for doing it up will be when I can afford it.

I don't really approve of the tramp-drift/scene tax crowd, simply because we've all seen too many very very good cars thrashed in the name of cheap drifting - and this applies to other cars as well, Vauxhall Omegas, Granadas, Sierras etc. And in my view 300s just arent suitable for drifting off-the-shelf, they're too balanced.

So I'll keep my car running as it is for now - if only to show other motorists that there are people out there who like these frankly rather odd dutch cars

[Chris_C]

and parts will always be a problem to get, hence very low numbers on the roads here

This is one thing we have to give the "tramp drifters". Because the car has cost them so little relatively they seem to have endless pennies compared to the rest of us for upgrade parts, hence some of the new parts development we've seen.

I'm pretty damn certain Dai wouldn't be able to sell the range of parts he does without their pennies and we can't forget he sells things like front suspension topmounts, which have been NLA for a significant number of years and being quite as mission critical as they are have caused a fair number of scrappages over the years.

Bloody hell, I think I just said a good thing about a tramp drifter I'll go cleanse myself

[foggyjames]

To be honest, the main problem I have with 300s is that there's not actually a good engine (or, more to the point, one well suited to the platform AND reliable) in the line-up...

(Waits for flame-fest)

cheers

James

[Edcase 300]

hmmmm I think the engines are not thaat bad reliabilitywise and are fairly simple but certainly agree that they could have done better i suppose..i mean look at the B200e in the 360..not a bad engine-very strong but it drinks like a 6 cyclinder engine,tbh they could have used better Bosch system like what the big Volvos where using but i think they downplayed the 300 in quite a few aspects...marketing and budget...Renault engines where cheaper thn Volvo designing thier own smaller units..(not bad engines though) and i think if they fitted the B230 in the top of the line 360s then performancewise the bigger Volvos wouldnt look so god from a performance point of view...

...mind you...(my dad bieng and engineer-hes probably right here when he says to me)..but Ed..the guys knew wht they were doing..every design has its limits i.e chassis may not handle power..maybe thats also reason why the 360 for instance develops peak torque pretty high up (4200ish revs versus peak power 5700-5800-in mine anyways)..maybe that was to make it easier to control (max torque too low down=drifting people who would rather not drift)..hmmm...just my two cents...

(this is a really interseting debate=its great)

[trabitom99]

Sure the V300 is still a 1970's design with engines designed in the 1960's. A modern car will beat it hands-down in almost every respect EXCEPT retro-fun. And I'd rather have more power in one too. But I wouldn't trade reliability (broken props?) or mpg (not that bad in standard form if everythings working as it should) for it. And "improving" and "modifying" until you have a completely different machine is certainly interesting, particularly if you have the talent and resources to handle a project like that, but it's not for me. If I manage to fit some foglights by myself, or a programmeable wash/wipe that's all the "mod satisfaction" I need

Tom

[340 Nate]

to be honest I know people would look at my clio 16v powered 340 and call it modified/rice, stainless steel exhaust, bucket seats etc etc.
but again as some said on this thread its better than on the scrap heap rotting?? when I bought bennett's 340 it was better off being scrapped after it's mot had run out as it was full of rusty goodness and engine was raped and running like shit when i got it.

now I could honestly say I have spent quite a bit on welding, new engine, adjustable dampers & polybushes (courtesy of Dai ), brakes, braided hoses, and much more (half needs to be fitted) but I am still a long way to go until I will be happy with the volvo.

many friends say its a shit car but I tell them where to go, now i have a standard red 340 which I want to repair the head gasket (which went on tuesday), weld the rotting front valance and all in all put it back into its former glory, it has blue line interior and a sunroof too .
so I do have respect for standard examples of the 300's and just pray people dont call me a 300 rapist .

cheers

nathan

[volvosneverdie]

Youre keeping two rolling man.^^^
Thats to be commended in my book.

Others may disagree.

[Chris_C]

But I wouldn't trade reliability (broken props?)

You are having a laugh The one engine in the line up worth having is about as reliable as something out of the BL factory, on a day where lucas was on strike, longbridge were in a trade dispute and the machines had broken! Broken props are an issue certainly, but nothing compared to carb base warping, wacking great airfilter stripping threads and general poncyness of that engine.

Actually, I dont truely believe that. The carb'd B19 is also a good engine AND reliable. So, all 360GLS' should remain stock

[Speedy88]

I agree with many points here. Just to add my 2p, my 1.7 was dished and most deffinatly on it's way out. Quite simply I want a 300. I'll keep this car for a long time but once I heard how easy the 16v swap was, I was all ears. I'm young, I like fast cars but I don't intend to trash my 300. It's worn out but I want to keep it as long as it will roll (which I'm guessing will be many years to come). It's almost been a year now and I'm still loving it. I also get a buzz from unmodified 300s (and 200s for that matter) just as much as I do from my own car. I want something everyone can enjoy looking at but also feels good to drive. These cars should be preserved for many years to come. Plans for my own car are more rare volvo parts, keeping the retro look but customising it all the same.

[340GLT]

Right i think its time for me to air an opinion.

Firstly standard 300's, i admit they have a certain charm and it was of course a standard 300 that i had to start with. I am biased as i grew up in a very volvo orientated background but even still i really have a soft spot for the 300 and if for my own use a standard 300 would suffice it would almost certainly be one of the cars in my lineup.

Right modified 300's which i'm sure i'm more known for. I pride myself in my engineering abilities and in the fact that on the whole they are self taught. When i was driving my 340 as a 1.4 it was ultra reliable and very comfortable. However whilst studying an engineering qualification and eing heavily into cars it was only natural to look at the 300 and look at ways to improve things. Which has led me to the modifications i have done to the grey car.
I pride myself on making the conversions, components look like they should be where they are and look 'almost' like they could of been a factory fit. I'm not one to rip out all the interier and chuck it in the bin. I always offer the parts up for sale or incorporate them into the vehicle in a modified condition. With the grey car 99% of the modifications could be reveresed to convert it back to a standard car.
The blue 1.7 saloon i am breaking i had full intensions of returning back to the road but couldnt due to the amount of rust. It would of course be possible to repair it all but not cost effective.

At the end of the day each to their own, but all modifications i have carried out to my 300's are to insure that I prefer the way it drives, handles and feels as a car.
After all i'm the one that lives with it day to day.

Adam

[foggyjames]

Very, very wise words from your father, Ed. Whenever I propose a modification from factory spec, I try to think why the factory didn't do it themselves. Often it's a matter of "horses for courses" (i.e. a lack of perceived demand), but sometimes I think there are engineering limitations we're willing to overlook. 340 prop strength is no doubt one of them...manufacturers have to allow much greater "headroom" for such things than enthusiasts will tolerate (unless they're Italian, of course).

Chris got what I meant. The 1.7 is the only engine which really suits the platform, and it's a reliability whore. If it had had EFI (and perhaps been a 2.0), they've have been laughing! The 1.4 is utterly loveable (in the same sense as a three legged dog), and the B19/200s are great...but should have been 23s/230s...at least NA, maybe turbo.

So...what to do? For my money, the F7P is the corker. I worry that the F7R is getting a bit too close to prop-eating territory...plus they're a bit harder to find...or you've got to "make" one. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to put down the F7R...they're awesome too...but given how cheap and readily available F7Ps are, it just seems to fit better with the concept of a 300 - building an awesome car cheaply and easily. The ease of fitment makes them better for most people than redblocks swaps, IMO.

Of course for the chosen few...redblocks are the way forward

cheers

James